European fixtures to be drawn on 17th June!

[Tigerbeat]

Saracens, Glasgow Warriors and Stade Français Paris will be guaranteed top seedings when the pool draw for the European Rugby Champions Cup takes place in Neuchâtel, Switzerland on Wednesday.This key event will get underway with the pool draw for next season's European Rugby Challenge Cup at 1.15pm (UK and Irish time) and the draw for the Champions Cup pools will follow immediately.

Both draws will be broadcast live on epcrugby.com with further coverage on Sky Sports News, beIN Sports and btsport.com

The event comperes in Neuchatel will be Craig Doyle (BT Sport) and Raphaël Ibañez (European Cup winner - France Televisions), with Dimitri Yachvili (Challenge Cup winner - beIN Sports) and Ieuan Evans (European Cup winner - Sky Sports) conducting the draws.

Twenty clubs from the Aviva Premiership, the Top 14 and the Guinness PRO12 have qualified on merit for the Champions Cup. The clubs will be divided into four tiers of five and a draw will be conducted to establish Tier 1 with two of the three second-ranked clubs - Bath Rugby, Munster Rugby and ASM Clermont Auvergne - joining Saracens, Glasgow Warriors and Stade Francais in the top tier.

Once Tier 1 has been established, the remaining three tiers will fall into place. Tier 2 will include the three third-ranked clubs from the leagues - Northampton Saints, RC Toulon and Ospreys - as well as the second-ranked club which was not drawn into Tier 1 and fourth-ranked club from the same league as the club which was not drawn into Tier 1.

Tier 3 will include the two clubs ranked fourth which are not in Tier 2 as well as the three fifth-ranked clubs from each league - Exeter Chiefs, Racing 92 and Leinster Rugby.

Tier 4 will contain the sixth-ranked clubs from the leagues - Wasps, Oyonnax and Scarlets - as well as Benetton Treviso and the winner of the Champions Cup play-offs, Bordeaux-Bègles.

When the tiers are completed, the draw proper for the five pools will be made, and during the draw, some clubs may have to be placed directly into a pool in order to ensure that the key principles apply (see below).

In Tier 4, Wasps will be drawn into a pool which contains one other Aviva Premiership club and Oyonnax and Bordeaux-Bègles will be drawn into pools which each contain one other Top 14 club.

Montpellier, Sale Sharks and Connacht Rugby are confirmed among the Tier 1 clubs for the Challenge Cup which will be conducted on similar lines with four tiers and five pools.

In Tier 4, Worcester Warriors will be drawn into a pool which contains one other Aviva Premiership club
Champions Cup qualification

For the purposes of creating the tiers, the Aviva Premiership, Top 14 and PRO12 clubs are ranked based on their league performances and on their performances in the knockout phases. For clubs which did not qualify for the knockout phases of their leagues, or which were eliminated at the same stage of the knockout phase, rankings are decided by league table finishing positions.
Rank Aviva Premiership Top 14 PRO12
1 Saracens Clermont or SF Paris Glasgow Warriors
2 Bath Rugby Clermont or SF Paris Munster Rugby
3 Northampton Saints RC Toulon Ospreys
4 Leicester Tigers Toulouse Ulster Rugby
5 Exeter Chiefs Racing 92 Leinster Rugby


Pool draws - key principles
The 20 clubs are divided into four tiers based on their qualification position from their leagues. This will be done where necessary by a draw.
The 20 clubs will then be divided into five pools of four clubs each.
Each of the five pools will have at least one club from each of the three leagues.
Each of the five pools will have one club from each of the four tiers.
There will be no more than two clubs from the same league in a pool.
No pool will contain two PRO12 clubs from the same country.
Clubs from the same league will be kept apart until the allocation of the Tier 4 clubs.

2015/16 Tournament weekends

Round 1: 12/13/14/15 November
Round 2: 19/20/21/22 November
Round 3: 10/11/12/13 December
Round 4: 17/18/19/20 December
Round 5: 14/15/16/17 January 2016
Round 6: 21/22/23/24 January 2016
Quarter-finals: 7/8/9/10 April 2016
Semi-finals: 22/23/24 April 2016
Finals: 13/14 May 2016

[Stu_F]

The Observer reports the draw as "including Bath, Saracens, Northampton, Exeter and Wasps". Should we take that as a compliment that we aren't worth mentioning?

[Stu_F]

Pool Draws for 2015/16 Challenge Cup and Champions Cup
11 June 2015 11:25am
Champions Cup Pool DrawWatch the pool draws live on 17th June at 13.15pmSaracens, Glasgow Warriors and the winners of Saturday's Top 14 final between ASM Clermont Auvergne and Stade Français Paris will be guaranteed top seedings when the pool draw for the European Rugby Champions Cup takes place in Neuchâtel, Switzerland next Wednesday (17 June).

This key event will get underway with the pool draw for next season's European Rugby Challenge Cup at 1.15pm (UK and Irish time) and the draw for the Champions Cup pools will follow immediately.

Both draws will be broadcast live on epcrugby.com with further coverage on Sky Sports News, beIN Sports and btsport.com

The event comperes in Neuchatel will be Craig Doyle (BT Sport) and Raphaël Ibañez (European Cup winner - France Televisions), with Dimitri Yachvili (Challenge Cup winner - beIN Sports) and Ieuan Evans (European Cup winner - Sky Sports) conducting the draws.

Twenty clubs from the Aviva Premiership, the Top 14 and the Guinness PRO12 have qualified on merit for the Champions Cup. The clubs will be divided into four tiers of five and a draw will be conducted to establish Tier 1 with two of the three second-ranked clubs - Bath Rugby, Munster Rugby and the Top 14 beaten finalists - joining Saracens, Glasgow Warriors and the Top 14 champions in the top tier.

Champions Cup qualification

For the purposes of creating the tiers, the Aviva Premiership, Top 14 and PRO12 clubs are ranked based on their league performances and on their performances in the knockout phases. For clubs which did not qualify for the knockout phases of their leagues, or which were eliminated at the same stage of the knockout phase, rankings are decided by league table finishing positions.
Rank Aviva Premiership Top 14 PRO12
1 Saracens Clermont or SF Paris Glasgow Warriors
2 Bath Rugby Clermont or SF Paris Munster Rugby
3 Northampton Saints RC Toulon Ospreys
4 Leicester Tigers Toulouse Ulster Rugby
5 Exeter Chiefs Racing 92 Leinster Rugby


Pool draws - key principles
The 20 clubs are divided into four tiers based on their qualification position from their leagues. This will be done where necessary by a draw.
The 20 clubs will then be divided into five pools of four clubs each.
Each of the five pools will have at least one club from each of the three leagues.
Each of the five pools will have one club from each of the four tiers.
There will be no more than two clubs from the same league in a pool.
No pool will contain two PRO12 clubs from the same country.
Clubs from the same league will be kept apart until the allocation of the Tier 4 clubs.

2015/16 Tournament weekends

Round 1: 12/13/14/15 November
Round 2: 19/20/21/22 November
Round 3: 10/11/12/13 December
Round 4: 17/18/19/20 December
Round 5: 14/15/16/17 January 2016
Round 6: 21/22/23/24 January 2016
Quarter-finals: 7/8/9/10 April 2016
Semi-finals: 22/23/24 April 2016
Finals: 13/14 May 2016

So we will be in Tier 3, so all I can conclude from this is that we can't be drawn with Sarries, Bath or Saints. There's nothing else is there? Other than not being possible to be in with Toulouse or Ulster.

[Doghashadhisday]

Knowing our luck we will get Glasgow, Munster and Toulon

[Iain]

Mr Tigerbeat sir! I believe you missed the sixth tier from your OP, containing the Wasps and Trevisos of this world.

Wasps can be drawn against any other English side by the way.

[Cagey Tiger]

Knowing our luck we will get Glasgow, Munster and Toulon

I know what you are getting at but this particular combination is not possible. Each group will contain two teams from tiers 1 - 3 and two from tiers 4 - 6. The above are all in tiers 1 - 3. As we are in tier 4 we will be getting 1 team from tiers 5 & 6 (so could get Racing or Leinster), plus 2 from tiers 1 - 3.

[Tigerbeat]

Mr Tigerbeat sir! I believe you missed the sixth tier from your OP, containing the Wasps and Trevisos of this world.

Wasps can be drawn against any other English side by the way.

Now updated OP...........noit sure how it was missed!!

Thanks

[MrPartridge]

A few observations:

Both draws will be broadcast live on epcrugby.com

Oh joy - last year this was epic!

While I appreciate the way the seedings work, how can 3 times champions Toulon be rank 3 and Glasgow 1? Its like Celtic being higher seeds than Barcelona!

Can we still draw Ulster? My initial thought was 'no' but I think it is still possible. No disrespect to Belfast and the fans at Ravenhill… I'd like a different trip for 2015/16.

I also fancy there is some sort of inevitability we might get Wasps…. think about it… the weekend away in Europe and all the excitement of a trip… down the M69 and to urmmm Coventry.

I'd quite like: Glasgow, Munster and Racing, please.

[Christophelp]

A few observations:

Both draws will be broadcast live on epcrugby.com

Oh joy - last year this was epic!

While I appreciate the way the seedings work, how can 3 times champions Toulon be rank 3 and Glasgow 1? Its like Celtic being higher seeds than Barcelona!

Can we still draw Ulster? My initial thought was 'no' but I think it is still possible. No disrespect to Belfast and the fans at Ravenhill… I'd like a different trip for 2015/16.

I also fancy there is some sort of inevitability we might get Wasps…. think about it… the weekend away in Europe and all the excitement of a trip… down the M69 and to urmmm Coventry.

I'd quite like: Glasgow, Munster and Racing, please.

No chance of drawing Glasgow, Munster AND Racing - Glasgow and Munster, being from the same league (and both being outside of Tier 4) cannot be drawn in the same pools.

Chances of drawing each of the teams (I think):

Stade 30.6%
Glasgow 30.6%
Clermont 26.8%
Munster 26.8%
Toulon 18.5%
Ospreys 18.5%
Toulouse 15.7%
Ulster 15.7%
Racing 8.3%
Leinster 8.3%
Wasps 20.9%
Oyonnax 20.9%
Scarlets 16.3%
Bordeaux 20.9%
Treviso 20.9%

[Iain]

Purely from a point of view of having the best value visitors come to us, Clermont and Munster would get my vote.

[Bill W (2)]

Purely from a point of view of having the best value visitors come to us, Clermont and Munster would get my vote.

Er.... I don't think our votes count! It is a draw!!

[Iain]

Purely from a point of view of having the best value visitors come to us, Clermont and Munster would get my vote.

Er.... I don't think our votes count! It is a draw!!

Just like regular democracy Bill!

Seriously, these days I see any kind of progress or success in Europe as a bonus. The dice are far too loaded against English sides and in particular English sides without deep pockets. As such, my objectives for Europe are to have some memorable occasions with the best visitors. Experience tells me Munster and Clermont would be a good pair to have. In the case of Clermont there's family on my wife's side we could have over.

I'd love to say a nice away trip would be nice but alas as a new father this is probably a mere pipe dream!

[ourla]

Purely from a point of view of having the best value visitors come to us, Clermont and Munster would get my vote.

Er.... I don't think our votes count! It is a draw!!

Just like regular democracy Bill!

Seriously, these days I see any kind of progress or success in Europe as a bonus. The dice are far too loaded against English sides and in particular English sides without deep pockets.

Sorry Iain, gotta take you to task on this. We beat Toulon at home last year. We beat Montpelier home and away the year before. Same season we lost by 6 to Clermont. As we did to Toulon the year before. Saracens have done pretty well over the last couple of years and I don't believe we are that far behind them. Please lets not view these matches as just nice days out. A home QF is vital to our chances so getting as an easy group as possible is paramount.

[neill_m]

If Munster Drawn in Pot 2

Pot 1: Saracens, Glasgow, Stade, Bath, Clermont
Pot 2: Munster, Northampton, Ospreys, Toulon, Ulster
Pot 3: Leicester, Toulouse, Leinster, Exeter, Racing Metro
Pot 4: Scarlets, Wasps, Treviso, Bordeaux, Oyonnax

If Bath Drawn in Pot 2

Pot 1: Saracens, Glasgow, Stade, Munster, Clermont
Pot 2: Bath, Northampton, Ospreys, Toulon, Leicester
Pot 3: Ulster, Toulouse, Leinster, Exeter, Racing Metro
Pot 4: Scarlets, Wasps, Treviso, Bordeaux, Oyonnax

If Clermont Drawn in Pot 2

Pot 1: Saracens, Glasgow, Stade, Bath, Munster
Pot 2: Clermont, Northampton, Ospreys, Toulon, Toulouse
Pot 3: Leicester, Ulster, Leinster, Exeter, Racing Metro
Pot 4: Scarlets, Wasps, Treviso, Bordeaux, Oyonnax

No more than 1 team from a particular league in a group in the 1st 3 pots, i.e. Glasgow (1) Clermont (2) Leicester (3). Pot 4 is open and any of the teams can be drawn.

[Iain]

Sorry Iain, gotta take you to task on this. We beat Toulon at home last year. We beat Montpelier home and away the year before. Same season we lost by 6 to Clermont. As we did to Toulon the year before. Saracens have done pretty well over the last couple of years and I don't believe we are that far behind them. Please lets not view these matches as just nice days out. A home QF is vital to our chances so getting as an easy group as possible is paramount.

Point me to the last English winner.

Unfortunately, French and (decreasingly so) Irish sides stand a greater chance of success, for a plethora of reasons. That's plainly evident.

Whilst we may have managed to compete comparatively well, the statistics aren't lying on this one.

The Premiership is, and should be, our priority. Success and progress in Europe is exciting and something we all want to see, but the pragmatist in us should recognise it as a lovely bonus.

My favourite thing about European games is the occasion. Surely we all prefer the big occasions and the pulsating nights at Welford Road ahead of some routine comfortable win over Treviso? Hence why I'd love to see Clermont and Munster this season.