Saracens red card

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kingol22
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Saracens red card

Post by kingol22 » Sun May 11, 2014 12:47 pm

They are going to contest the red card and will almost certainly be successful. I didn't see the game but apparently Briggs told the ref he hadn't been gouged and yet the red card was given, very poor from the officials and it should have been checked. Thankfully Saracens were not in a position where the loss cost them anything in the table.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/27359328

Stu_F
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Re: Saracens red card

Post by Stu_F » Sun May 11, 2014 1:57 pm

I doubt Briggs was in a position to say anything to the ref because Tigers were back in their own half as the try had already been given. That may have been the problem because I imagine they wouldn't have had much idea what the touchjudge was saying and hence couldn't comment on it.

I seem to remember an All Black being "sent off" at Llanelli once an the ref being persuaded to change his mind by the Llanelli captain (Phil Bennett). Luckily, for the ref, this was pre to the use of cards. 1980?

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Re: Saracens red card

Post by DickyP » Sun May 11, 2014 2:35 pm

Must admit that there was total bafflement in the crowd at the incident.

Conversely it does counterbalance the lack of yellow cards for Mélé almost losing his head to a high tackle in the 'red-zone', and the deliberate knock on when Tigers looked dangerous near Sarries line. It only appears to be Tigers who get Yellows for the latter!
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Re: Saracens red card

Post by Stu_F » Sun May 11, 2014 3:36 pm

Mr Garner did actually refer the Mele incident before it was given, by who?, as just a penalty. Indeed the penalty may have been for something else!

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Re: Saracens red card

Post by jgriffin » Mon May 12, 2014 9:44 am

Au contraire, there was some indication why the TJ, correctly in my view, referred it to the ref when you view the ITV4 replay footage. There is contact with the face. The ref should've asked Briggs if he had been gouged etc before giving a card or not. Briggs would probably have said no.
I have little sympathy after our experiences with supposed eye contact.
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mol2
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Re: Saracens red card

Post by mol2 » Mon May 12, 2014 10:15 am

The whole eye contact issue is a minefield.
In terms of the offence accidental is not a defence however it is mitigation for the punishment.

The idea being it is your responsibility as a player to make sure you don't go near the eyes and if playing the ball takes you close to the eyes then don't go there.
How practical that interpretation is I'm not sure.
Accidents will always happen so is red carding appropriate and the psychopathic thugs may well still do it but may well do so less often as they can't claim accidental as a defence.

It's less daft than the current interpretation of the laws relating to jumping for the ball. Both players can both be genuinely playing the ball - the two collide and the one who gets the ball doesn't get punished, the other does and the punishment depends on how the one who wins the ball lands!
Bonkers. With video refs it's usually easy enough to see who is genuinely competing for the ball rather than merely looking at the ball. (jumping up with hands in the expected flight of the ball)

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Re: Saracens red card

Post by Noddy555 » Mon May 12, 2014 10:53 am

In my view the Red card was given to the wrong player, Tagibakaku should have got it for his tip tackle on Marcos Ayerza. Poor Justin Melck offence, a hand across the mouth was not even worth a yellow card, probably just a ticking off
and a penalty. I thought the standard of refereeing was poor and lacked consistency. Mind you tigers first half performance withe exception of the last 5 minutes ranked with their worst performancies of the season.

tigerburnie
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Re: Saracens red card

Post by tigerburnie » Mon May 12, 2014 12:43 pm

jgriffin wrote:Au contraire, there was some indication why the TJ, correctly in my view, referred it to the ref when you view the ITV4 replay footage. There is contact with the face. The ref should've asked Briggs if he had been gouged etc before giving a card or not. Briggs would probably have said no.
I have little sympathy after our experiences with supposed eye contact.
I tend to agree with this, looking at the highlights Melk had his hands all over his face pulling his head back, he should not have been doing that, Briggs clearly said something to him about it.
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Re: Saracens red card

Post by LessThanSte » Mon May 12, 2014 10:51 pm

I thought all of them could have been no cards.

Tagibakaku was a tip tackle, but looked infinutely worse than it was. Still, by the new interpretation I guess it had to be a yellow. Certainly not a red.

Mele was falling over. The tackle was messy, but wouldnt have been high had Mele not slipped. Ref correctly ignored it, imo (i assume he had a quick word to calm down, though...)
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Re: Saracens red card

Post by daktari » Tue May 13, 2014 8:14 am

Noddy555 wrote:In my view the Red card was given to the wrong player, Tagibakaku should have got it for his tip tackle on Marcos Ayerza. Poor Justin Melck offence, a hand across the mouth was not even worth a yellow card, probably just a ticking off
and a penalty. I thought the standard of refereeing was poor and lacked consistency. Mind you tigers first half performance withe exception of the last 5 minutes ranked with their worst performancies of the season.
It's been a red a card since the World Cup so to only show a yellow was poor. The red card was very odd, it seems harsh on reflection but that said, players have been given long bans for the same thing.
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Brianf
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Re: Saracens red card

Post by Brianf » Wed May 14, 2014 9:07 am

Well, the red card has been overturned by the RFU...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/27359328

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Re: Saracens red card

Post by APJones » Wed May 14, 2014 1:15 pm

If you look at one of the excellent photos by GW shown in the Tigers facebook gallery and probably elsewhere. There is a very clear photo of Charlie Hodgesons outstreched arm with his hand in contact with TTTEs face - cheek just below the eye. Distorting TTTEs face. Charlies back is towards the camera and TTTE is running with the ball towards the camera.
This contact could easily be classed as the eye area yet it was either not seen or it was ignored. TTTE lost the ball and a try was scored.
I did send a copy of the photo to Sarries DoR in answer to his press release complaining about Melkes red card - but surprisingly have not recieved a reply. :smt017

There were a lot of dubious decisions by the Ref and some not so clean tackling etc by Sarries but Tigers didn't capitilize on the 13 - 14 man opposition. We should have won by more points but in the end a 5 point win by both Tigers and Stains (74- 13 that should have been our score !)meant no change in the table. cest la vie. Roll on Friday night.
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