Sale v Tigers

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TigerinLowton
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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by TigerinLowton » Mon May 05, 2014 4:04 pm

Just watched the recording and thought the defence was outstanding in the first half when it mattered. First ten minutes was all Sale, and there must have been half a dozen tackles within five metres of the try line that were just knocked back.

Some of the arrogance of some Tigers fans, expecting us to beat every team by 50 points is staggering.

4071
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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by 4071 » Tue May 06, 2014 9:16 am

baz1664 wrote:Replacements have been poor and that's why we need to strengthen, Balmain looks overweight, The tank not interested and Briggs not good enough; Saracens wouldn't do this, poor poor!! 22 -35 now!!
Saracens wouldn't do what?

Make wholesale substitutions?

Actually, you could not be more wrong. Saracens have made more substitutions per game than any other team in the Premiership. Leicester have made the least.

Perhaps that's one reason that there is a bit of a drop-off when our subs do come on - Sarries rotate more and give more players game time during matches, whereas Tigers don't rotate by choice and leave players on the bench more often.

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by Pellsey » Tue May 06, 2014 9:48 am

I would suggest, 4071, the reason behind us not making many substitutions this season, is due to the amount of injuries we have had, and our strength in depth had been tested. Due to Tigers having to play the reserves for most of the season, I think we have had the game time. The first team just have not had the game time, and I think still need time to play together. Hence the lack of substitutions recently.

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by baz1664 » Tue May 06, 2014 10:47 am

4071 wrote:
baz1664 wrote:Replacements have been poor and that's why we need to strengthen, Balmain looks overweight, The tank not interested and Briggs not good enough; Saracens wouldn't do this, poor poor!! 22 -35 now!!
Saracens wouldn't do what?

Make wholesale substitutions?

Actually, you could not be more wrong. Saracens have made more substitutions per game than any other team in the Premiership. Leicester have made the least.

Perhaps that's one reason that there is a bit of a drop-off when our subs do come on - Sarries rotate more and give more players game time during matches, whereas Tigers don't rotate by choice and leave players on the bench more often.
Tigers shipped 3 try's with the mass introduction of the replacements against sale, there was a lack of intensity and seemed to be going through the motions, as for Saracens they have been the model of consistency throughout there starting 15 and bench, that's why they are still in with a shout for two trophies, the tigers bench needs to step up in the playoffs or were going to be in trouble in the last 20 minutes, tigers injury crisis is now over and bench against sale was strong and should have held it's own against sale who at the time had made lots of changes. Hopefully cockers will add the likes of Hawkins, Mafi and Kitch to the bench for the play offs as there experience could be invaluable.

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by 4071 » Tue May 06, 2014 3:20 pm

Pellsey wrote:I would suggest, 4071, the reason behind us not making many substitutions this season, is due to the amount of injuries we have had, and our strength in depth had been tested. Due to Tigers having to play the reserves for most of the season, I think we have had the game time. The first team just have not had the game time, and I think still need time to play together. Hence the lack of substitutions recently.
Well, that's a theory.

However, when you look at the number of Tigers players who have started 20+ games this season (out of 32), it's more than Saracens (in 34 games). We've got 7 players with 20+ starts to Saracens' 5. So at least the core of a first team has played a lot of rugby.

And when you look at the number of players to have started half of all games this season (16 starts for us, 17 starts for Saracens), we have 12 players to their 11.

Yet when you get down to the number of players to have picked up a decent number of starts, such as one third of all games (10 starts for us, 11 starts for Sarries) then they have utilised their squad more than us, with 26 players to our 23.


What this suggests is that Saracens have spread regular starts over a greater part of their squad without overplaying their first team. They have done this whilst ALSO utilising their bench a lot more. So the suggestion that our lack of substitutions is down to the injury crisis and then the need to get game time for our first team doesn't seem to stand up to any scrutiny.


It's simply a long-standing preference for Cockerill not to make substitutions.

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by Tigerbeat » Tue May 06, 2014 3:38 pm

Had this been a closer game, Cockerill may well have left the same players on for longer.
If you are winning, the need for substitutions is not really required. If you are behind, you need to change your plans and maybe use fresh legs.

I remember the days when you could only bring on subs in the case of an injury!!
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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by Rykard » Tue May 06, 2014 3:39 pm

i think it's more that RC has said he will make substitutions to make an impact, it says to me that sarries have(had) a better quality bench.. with us getting players back hopefully we can have a very strong 23 rather than 20-21...
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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by tigerburnie » Tue May 06, 2014 6:40 pm

One question(well two actually), which club has been in the last 10 playoffs and which team has won more of them? Clue is they are the current Champions.
Just thought of another question, which teams replica shirt would we not be seen dead in?
There's a bit of a party atmosphere around Bath this afternoon - but you wouldn't get that at Leicester if we finished ninth." Richard Cockerill 7/5/16

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by mightymouse » Wed May 07, 2014 7:37 pm

Tigerbeat - sadly I remember the days whenm there where no replacements allowed at all - strangely very few injuries happed and when they did you just played on with 14 men - even in internationals

Mike Gibson was apparently the first official international replacement - coming on for the injured Barry John in the first Lions test of the 1968 tour of South Africa

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by tigerburnie » Thu May 08, 2014 10:00 am

We used to have two injury replacements that went with the team, at Tigers level they could only come on if a doctor said the player coming off was unfit to continue. However, I think the physicality and intensity is very different now to what it was then. I was considered a big lad at 6 foot 4 back then, probably average for the backs these days.
There's a bit of a party atmosphere around Bath this afternoon - but you wouldn't get that at Leicester if we finished ninth." Richard Cockerill 7/5/16

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by APJones » Thu May 08, 2014 1:29 pm

tigerburnie wrote:Win or lose next week, it looks like we play the sinners and let's face it, it won't really matter if it's at Franklins Gardens, they are running out of steam and can't buy a win against us. The final at Twickenham is a one off, we can beat anyone there on our day.
2006 final - who did we lose against ? :smt017
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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by Smurphswillgetya » Fri May 09, 2014 12:00 am

APJones wrote:
2006 final - who did we lose against ? :smt017
Pardon my ignorance but why did you pick 2006. We lost against Sale, so what? It wasn't our day. Why not pick 2006/7 season, we were champions and guess who was relegated!
Of course this is my own opinion and other posters may have a different perceived factual viewpoint.

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by APJones » Fri May 09, 2014 10:07 am

The thread is for the Sale game.
The last sentence of the quote I quoted was The final is at Twickenham is a one off, we can beat anyone there on the day

I referred to the 2006 final because Sale beat us 'on the day '

BTW I was in the West stand at Sale and if you watched the game on TV I was the fan the commentary team commented about just before kick off - the one with the tiger headgear on that they did a close up of !
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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by Tiger_in_Birmingham » Fri May 09, 2014 12:39 pm

Smurphswillgetya wrote:
APJones wrote:
2006 final - who did we lose against ? :smt017
Pardon my ignorance but why did you pick 2006. We lost against Sale, so what? It wasn't our day. Why not pick 2006/7 season, we were champions and guess who was relegated!
Not to mention that 8 years is quite a while in professional sport - over half the squad turned over since then I would suspect

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Re: Sale v Tigers

Post by mightymouse » Fri May 09, 2014 1:40 pm

I'll tell you who played very well that day, and was the architect of our downfall - Charlie Hodgson - he had poor old Alex in a right mess with very clever kicking game - and he is playing 10 against on Saturday!

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