Smudge wrote:What on earth are you talking about TB?
Twelvetrees had a very decent game and worked his socks off.
Crash balls were clearly the game plan. He put in some great hits too.
Agreed Smudge. He is much heavier than Barritt, taller than Barritt, and he can kick. So as long as he doesn't become liability in defense, he will get selected ahead of Barritt.
If Burgess proves himself at 12, then the same reasons will be brought to selection. And the same reason they would rather play Manu at 12 than 13.
As long as he doesn't become a liability in defence? Even at club level he's been shown up in defence. He missed 4 tackles today, the most on the team. He missed multiple tackles last week as well. He is a liability in defence. That's just how it is. And that's fine, but it means that it's something he needs to work on if he wants to be an international quality centre. As is Burgess will walk in to the team and no one outside Glocs/Leics will raise an eyebrow.
Not to say he's not rightly ahead of Barritt, but frankly that has nothing to do with Twelvetree's defence.
Smudge wrote:What on earth are you talking about TB?
Twelvetrees had a very decent game and worked his socks off.
Crash balls were clearly the game plan. He put in some great hits too.
Agreed Smudge. He is much heavier than Barritt, taller than Barritt, and he can kick. So as long as he doesn't become liability in defense, he will get selected ahead of Barritt.
If Burgess proves himself at 12, then the same reasons will be brought to selection. And the same reason they would rather play Manu at 12 than 13.
As long as he doesn't become a liability in defence? Even at club level he's been shown up in defence. He missed 4 tackles today, the most on the team. He missed multiple tackles last week as well. He is a liability in defence. That's just how it is. And that's fine, but it means that it's something he needs to work on if he wants to be an international quality centre. As is Burgess will walk in to the team and no one outside Glocs/Leics will raise an eyebrow.
Not to say he's not rightly ahead of Barritt, but frankly that has nothing to do with Twelvetree's defence.
I agree with you on his poor defence BG, which is why I raised it. His defence is not good enough for this level right now. I hope it improves. My point really was he musnt become a liability. You argue it is already, and the statistics are certainly ugly and many would say he is. It is borderline.
First and foremost, i thought it was a cracking game of rugby!
Well played England....these games are decided by small margins and today (unlike in France)that went for us.
i thougt 36 was good but agree his defence does need attention. That's the one reson Cockers kept picking Allen ahead of him and nothing much has changed in that regard...
I thougt the only disappointing player was May. Althought he did some good things, he is decidedly dodgy under the high ball and his finishing was v poor twice.
I see Yarde is back on the bench for LI today, if he comes on and plays well and then gets 80 mins next week and plays well, I would put him back in for May.
In the centres I can see competition at 12 between 36 and Burrell (once Manu is back). If SL isn't too worried about a kicking 12 then Burrell is certainly a more destructive straight line runner and it would be a powerful partnership indeed.
Good game played at a cracking pace. Lots of positives for England - the negatives were the two possibly three tries left on the pitch and Farrell.
He is a courageous defender and kicks well but, not only does he lack vision, his nasty, petulant displays of violent temper will one day lead to an England loss as he gives away a penalty and is yellow carded.
tigerburnie wrote:What has happened to Billy Twelvetrees, offering nothing at all, disappointing.
Sorry tb - I think you were watching a different game than most of us - I was there at HQ yesterday with two Wasp fans and we all thought 36 played a VG game - what you may not have seen on the TV at home is the amount of talking and encouragement he was giving the other players - he is a player who is happy to go into dirty and tough situations more than others who would think twice about.
I think he is one of the engines of the squad
Very pleased with his overall performance and he should return with the 12 shirt for Wales. I think SL should continue with the current squad - I would add Henry Trinder on the bench
I'm on record as a huge fan of Billys, but he just looked out of place, he looks pretty good at Glaws, what I've seen of him.He put in a couple of good tackles but dropped off a few and made little by way of getting over the gain line. Compare him with the other 12's on show over the weekend and he didn't shine as well as I would have liked, that is why I was disappointed.
"If you want entertainment, go to the theatre," says Edinburgh head coach Richard Cockerill. "Rugby players play the game to win.15/1/21.
I'm with you TB. Billy has been rather disappointing. Missed tackles, poor decisions, shown little of his passing game. Just looks ordinary. I was expecting him to really grow into his role behind this England pack, but he just isn't standing out at all. Still a problem position for England.
tigerburnie wrote:What has happened to Billy Twelvetrees, offering nothing at all, disappointing.
Sorry tb - I think you were watching a different game than most of us - I was there at HQ yesterday with two Wasp fans and we all thought 36 played a VG game - what you may not have seen on the TV at home is the amount of talking and encouragement he was giving the other players - he is a player who is happy to go into dirty and tough situations more than others who would think twice about.
I think he is one of the engines of the squad
Very pleased with his overall performance and he should return with the 12 shirt for Wales. I think SL should continue with the current squad - I would add Henry Trinder on the bench
Shedhead1
Hmm. Let's fill the England squad up with Cherry and whites; you may have noticed that Lancaster picks on form...
36 is a good club player but has weaknesses that are being (and will continue to be) exposed at international level. However, I don't see Manu or Burrell being able to distribute well enough to play international inside centre. If Burgess steps up, maybe he would be be a better 12 as league converts tend to have a better passing game?
I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed man
