Lack of players cost us tonight

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G.K
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by G.K »

youngtiger wrote:
...So what you're arguing is that when the guys got in at half time, the coaches sat them all down and gave them a right good talking to about how they weren't to score any more tries, make any more line breaks and must immediately stop competing at the breakdown?
Unfortunately from what I saw in the second half this appears to be exactly what must have happened, or they just decided this collectively amongst themselves.
Nowadays referees decide matches, players by how much.
exiledandy
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by exiledandy »

chappie wrote:...all I will say is the 9 points missed by GF cost us the game... Two blocks by the Fez heads should have been picked up by both the Linesman and the ref resulting in two of there try's. :smt023
Please support your team, we don't live in a blame culture world. :smt023
Sounds to me like you are blaming George Ford, the linesmen and the referee. So much for not living in a blame culture world!

IMHO we lost due to a combination of the following:
  • Sarries' strength in depth compared to our limited resources (especially from the bench)
    Their better executed gameplan over 80 minutes (including use of the bench)
    Our defensive weaknesses
    Our lack of consistent ideas creation (save for one obvious moment)
LE18
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by LE18 »

Why was the outragous block by Strettle when they miss passed in the final phase to score their last try not picked up by ref, he just awarded the try with no ref back to the TMO. Last week how far did TMO have to go back to satisfy Mr Barnes, if you are going to have a Tmo he must be consistently referred to not just ignored. ( Ps i am not really in favour of tmo, let ref do his job.)
butler8
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by butler8 »

well you suggested to someone that they 'Change the record and try levelling an argument that's actually relevant' which you supported with facts soley based on 40 mins play. im presuming you've found out that the game is an 80 min one now? my point was that the second 40 was a polar opposite and utterly unacceptable from the squad of players we had out.

i think we are all disappointed to varying levels for varying reasons but please dont pick someone up on there research or lack of when you are only here to offer an opinion and not dictate who may be closer to the real problem than others.

i think what i wrote was very similar to yours regarding the 2 halves being of vastly differing quality and end result and the reasons being ... well thats why we use this forum, non of us really know. i think it is because we, the players, are trained in a way that doesnt allow us to express our skills and play a 'brand of rugby' that is exciting, explosive, inventive and entertaining. not because they are sat down at half time leading 17-6 and told not to do the same, what an utterly ridiculous thing to suggest. thats why im so frustrated and read what others think to broaden my thoughts and maybe pick up on what i may have missed!

bottom line is we play boring rugby that is becoming more evident by the week to be ineffective against better opposition. now i look forward to coming back on here post toulon to enjoy a hositoric victory with my tail between my legs ... cant see it though can you? :smt009
kend
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by kend »

The 6 nations period was bound to be difficult with key games against both Quins and Sarries. There is an argument that two losing bonus points from those games isn't too a bad outcome given the absences (I still maintain that Tigers are disproportionally affected by the internationals - three front row and both first choice half-backs missing is a substantial handicap).

IMHO it wasn't that Tigers stopped playing or competing. Sarries were able to up their playing intensity in the second-half (it's notable that they used their whole bench) and Tigers couldn't match that; I'm pretty sure they would have continued to play in the same way as the first half if they could have done. I sometimes wonder if posters forget there is another team on the pitch!
Smurphswillgetya
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by Smurphswillgetya »

kend wrote:I sometimes wonder if posters forget there is another team on the pitch!
What world are you living in? There is no other team on the pitch and it does not matter who you have available to wear the Tigers shirt, we should be scoring bonus point wins and nilling the opposition every week. :smt003
Of course this is my own opinion and other posters may have a different perceived factual viewpoint.
butler8
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by butler8 »

Smurphswillgetya wrote:
kend wrote:I sometimes wonder if posters forget there is another team on the pitch!
What world are you living in? There is no other team on the pitch and it does not matter who you have available to wear the Tigers shirt, we should be scoring bonus point wins and nilling the opposition every week. :smt003
normal wins would be sufficient and minimising the oppositions score would be a less sarcastic reality. something we are more than capable of but rarely seeming to achieve. that is the frustration not some peoples over exaggerated verbal diarrhea.
as before, we know there are internatinal periods in the season and we should recruit accordingly. if that means less players from the home countries so be it. i'd rather have a winning tigers team than a winning england team!!
thats what sarries and others seem to have done so they have impact from the bench and a less fractured squad to pick from. we cant have it all ways and my loyalties lie at welford rd
tigerburnie
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by tigerburnie »

+
butler8 wrote:
Smurphswillgetya wrote:
kend wrote:I sometimes wonder if posters forget there is another team on the pitch!
What world are you living in? There is no other team on the pitch and it does not matter who you have available to wear the Tigers shirt, we should be scoring bonus point wins and nilling the opposition every week. :smt003
normal wins would be sufficient and minimising the oppositions score would be a less sarcastic reality. something we are more than capable of but rarely seeming to achieve. that is the frustration not some peoples over exaggerated verbal diarrhea.
as before, we know there are internatinal periods in the season and we should recruit accordingly. if that means less players from the home countries so be it. i'd rather have a winning tigers team than a winning england team!!
thats what sarries and others seem to have done so they have impact from the bench and a less fractured squad to pick from. we cant have it all ways and my loyalties lie at welford rd
But your loyalty was born on the back of previous Tigers teams,who have always been a mixture of home nations internationals and those from further afield. To change that would remove our clubs identity and for what?
Rugby is fast changing and is certainly a different sport to a decade ago,but the roots shouldn't be binned. The thing that has changed is playing in a league and expected to play during the international period,that is what should be changed.
"If you want entertainment, go to the theatre," says Edinburgh head coach Richard Cockerill. "Rugby players play the game to win.15/1/21.
butler8
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by butler8 »

im not doubting they should be a mixture of home nations and those from further afield. im saying they should be slightly more from further afield or ex internationals to offset the loss of home nations players through the autumn and 6 nations. that should provide continuity and a strength in the squad we are sorely lacking.
it has nothing to do with identity or roots. if anything those who hesitate have held this club back and for us to say the game has changed but we still havnt should ask themselves why.
our style of play reeks of that attitude. we are sluggish and boring. and for the people who can offer me the first half on saturday as proof otherwise should look at the second 40mins and try to explain if one justifies the other!
i wish meyer had still been here we would have been a very exciting side by now. modern and explosive. worth turning up to watch, not what we have become.

we can all agree to disagree but im really fed up of what i see week in week out.its boring the life out of me!!
youngtiger
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by youngtiger »

butler8 wrote:Well you suggested to someone that they 'Change the record and try levelling an argument that's actually relevant' which you supported with facts solely based on 40 mins play.

the players, are trained in a way that doesn't allow us to express our skills and play a 'brand of rugby' that is exciting, explosive, inventive and entertaining. not because they are sat down at half time leading 17-6 and told not to do the same, what an utterly ridiculous thing to suggest.

bottom line is we play boring rugby that is becoming more evident by the week to be ineffective against better opposition. Now I look forward to coming back on here post Toulon to enjoy a historic victory with my tail between my legs ... cant see it though can you? :smt009
Yes, but your argument was, and seemingly still is, that the coaching meant that they were incapable of creating chances. Yet, in the first half they were perfectly capable of doing so, so I can't see how the coaches could have made it made it so that they were incapable in the 2nd half; they simply can't be at fault for that kind of capitulation. Obviously I said that to show the "ridiculous", as you put it, nature of the notion that the coaches are at fault for the players failing to do what they did in the 1st half.

Well, I suppose that boring rugby includes 80m tries then? But I suppose, if that's the bottom line... You can't simply ignore the first 40 for the poor quality of the second. Had we been incapable the entire game, then that's fair, but we weren't so it's not. As for Toulon, with our internationals back I expect us to give it a go, I remain optimistic :smt026
Hinckley Bob
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by Hinckley Bob »

The RFU should realise that teams who currently produce most England players are being penalised and those with a nucleus of oversees players are benefitting and reward accordingly. Financial rewards to the clubs should be proportionate to their contribution to the national side and this money should be allowed to be spent over and above the wage cap on providing a larger squad to cover international periods.
sapajo
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by sapajo »

Hinckley Bob wrote:The RFU should realise that teams who currently produce most England players are being penalised and those with a nucleus of oversees players are benefitting and reward accordingly. Financial rewards to the clubs should be proportionate to their contribution to the national side and this money should be allowed to be spent over and above the wage cap on providing a larger squad to cover international periods.
Makes sense, but I do not believe for a microsecond that the RFU give a flying fig, they have their cake and they continue to enjoy eating it. :smt045
Without hope we are nothing, keep the faith, a Tiger for eternity
Hinckley Bob
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by Hinckley Bob »

sapajo wrote:
Hinckley Bob wrote:The RFU should realise that teams who currently produce most England players are being penalised and those with a nucleus of oversees players are benefitting and reward accordingly. Financial rewards to the clubs should be proportionate to their contribution to the national side and this money should be allowed to be spent over and above the wage cap on providing a larger squad to cover international periods.
Makes sense, but I do not believe for a microsecond that the RFU give a flying fig, they have their cake and they continue to enjoy eating it. :smt045
That could be very short-sighted if Tigers and others decided to put the club first and the national team suffered.
sapajo
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by sapajo »

Hinckley Bob wrote:
sapajo wrote:
Hinckley Bob wrote:The RFU should realise that teams who currently produce most England players are being penalised and those with a nucleus of oversees players are benefitting and reward accordingly. Financial rewards to the clubs should be proportionate to their contribution to the national side and this money should be allowed to be spent over and above the wage cap on providing a larger squad to cover international periods.
Makes sense, but I do not believe for a microsecond that the RFU give a flying fig, they have their cake and they continue to enjoy eating it. :smt045
That could be very short-sighted if Tigers and others decided to put the club first and the national team suffered.
Agreed but the chances of that happening are I believe are currently zilch.
Without hope we are nothing, keep the faith, a Tiger for eternity
tigerburnie
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Re: Lack of players cost us tonight

Post by tigerburnie »

It is not the arghfu who decide how the money is divided,it is the clubs in the prl.It is the other clubs who voted to share out the money equally.
"If you want entertainment, go to the theatre," says Edinburgh head coach Richard Cockerill. "Rugby players play the game to win.15/1/21.
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