Castro: "It must happen before the 6N starts!"

[tigerburnie]

Martin has been a great servant for this club, I think we have treated him fairly,but I don't know that,I'm only assuming.It is a shame if he leaves with a cloud over his head,but if you will excuse the corny pun "it's not personal,it's just business"
Sadly we saw this with Lewis Moody and before that even when Deano left,the club business has to come before sentiment in the pro era.
We did not approach Toulon and say do you want to buy our prop,did we?

[The Boy Dave]

We did not approach Toulon and say do you want to buy our prop,did we?

A firm yes or no would suffice. Maybe created the cloud!

[tigerburnie]

A firm yes or no would suffice. Maybe created the cloud!

I don't understand that Dave.
We presume that Toulon made an approach or maybe Martins agent approached them,I don't know, either way we didn't start the conversation.
All we seem to have done is said he has one year left on his contract,if he wants to go then you will have to pay compensation.
So either Castro wants to go,but when it suits him rather than us, or he thought we would pay him even more to stay,which clearly we don't want to.
As I said before, it's business,when contracts of any sort are up for re-newal both sides jockey for position to get the best deal.It can't all be Cockers fault if we did not open the talks,some blame lies with others,either Toulon or Castro or his agent.

[mightymouse]

Everyone loves Castro

Great Player great Character

But the facts of life are

1) he is not as good as he used to be
2) Cole is better and gets more starts
3) we are held tight fast by a salary cap (Toulon are not)
4) Castro takes a large chunk of that cap
5) We now have Loggo and Fraser and a therefore not as desperate to keep him as we used to be
6) we live in a professional world - Players have comercial power when they have an irreplacable talent - Clubs have comercial power when players become replaceable

Castro will always be a Tiger Legend just like Lewis Moody but I have limited sympathy with players who demand big bucks and play hard ball in negotiation then wonder why a club is sometimes happy to let them go when they are no longer able to justify "The big Bucks"!

[Noggs]

Did nobody hear the interview with Cockers on the subject?

When asked about Castro he said that Toulon had offered him a 3 year contract and that he fully understood why this would be attractive to Martin. He went on to say that Leicester were in discussions with Toulon to see if a deal could be agreed to release him whilest he still has a year left on his Leicester contract. In the end, if an offer was not deemed in the best interests of Leicester Martin whould be held to the terms of his existing contract. Cockers also said that the discussions with Martin were friendly and that Martin fully understood and accepted the position, pointing out that it was a two way road with the club paying the wages of players when injured, etc. and players being equally obliged to honour contractural commitments.

[mol2]

For me Cole is the best tight head in world rugby at present. That's unfortunate for Castro who, when at is best has been one of, if not the best.

If he had worn a black shirt he would have had the recognition he deserves (outside of Leicester that is).
Likewise with Cole - is there anyone else truly in the running for the Lions TH berth?

[The Boy Dave]

I don't understand that Dave.
We presume that Toulon made an approach or maybe Martins agent approached them,I don't know, either way we didn't start the conversation.
All we seem to have done is said he has one year left on his contract,if he wants to go then you will have to pay compensation.
So either Castro wants to go,but when it suits him rather than us, or he thought we would pay him even more to stay,which clearly we don't want to.
As I said before, it's business,when contracts of any sort are up for re-newal both sides jockey for position to get the best deal.It can't all be Cockers fault if we did not open the talks,some blame lies with others,either Toulon or Castro or his agent.

A club needs to make it's mind up very quickly, do we want this player or not!
Holding out for more money has put a strain on the relationship and should the deal fall through or an injury occur to another player we may have lost a true legend who always gives 100%. Castro play's with his heart on his sleeve and that should have been recognised. Whichever way this goes this episode will hurt him!

[WhitecapTiger]

A club needs to make it's mind up very quickly, do we want this player or not!
Holding out for more money has put a strain on the relationship and should the deal fall through or an injury occur to another player we may have lost a true legend who always gives 100%. Castro play's with his heart on his sleeve and that should have been recognised. Whichever way this goes this episode will hurt him!

I agree that minds should be made up very quickly. But if you are suggesting that we should just lie down, roll over and let a French club breeze in, decide they want one of our players with a year left to run, offer a (imo) derisory offer and get it all their own way?

If so you'd be supporting a (faster?) decline into similar depths that football 'business' and 'contracts' have dropped to.

Castro was indeed very loyal to Tigers when he was offered more money to go to France, but he did sign a 3 year deal, and I presume Tigers took their usual stance of 'no gurantees' over starting berths.

[The Boy Dave]

I agree that minds should be made up very quickly. But if you are suggesting that we should just lie down, roll over and let a French club breeze in, decide they want one of our players with a year left to run, offer a (imo) derisory offer and get it all their own way?

Lie down and roll over? Not at all!
The player is contracted until 2014, he is our player. If we simply don't rate him anymore, say so. If his agant has started all of this, say so. If Toulon have come calling and we are seeing pound signs then say so, but don't play silly games with players that deserve better. I can totally understand the Ford and 36 situations getting beyond the control of R.C but this one smells very bad. It does not show this club in a good light. The t-shirts in the club shop read "Tigersfamily" not "show us the money".

[TomWeston]

If we simply don't rate him anymore, say so. If his agant has started all of this, say so. If Toulon have come calling and we are seeing pound signs then say so, but don't play silly games with players that deserve better.

Are you certain that the club are playing games? You assume that the two scenarios which you invoke cover all possibilities.

Which of the two Peters would you like to send you handwritten notes on the state of contract negotiations with players or would you like an invitation to their meetings with the players?

[Smurphswillgetya]

It seems to me that there are some on here who always think it is either RC or the clubs fault when a player leaves or wants to leave and never seem to consider that it may not be anyone's fault but a fact of the current market situation. We could have lost Parling and Mafi but they both stayed but does RC get any praise for that?

[Big Dai]

I feel about the same on this as when Garforth hung up his boots. A favourite of mine is leaving. I know perhaps he's not the force he was........but you can't help but like the guy and recognise his contribution on and off the pitch.

[tigerburnie]

It seems to me that Toulon have made a move on our player and it is causing upset for the player concerned,I cannot understand how anyone can then lay any blame at our door.We have a player under contract,if the gossip is believed, the best contract any player at the club is on and untill the contract is bought out,then the player is contracted to continue with us.
The player doesn't like this third party interest,then they are the ones who can end it by saying "no thanks,I have a year to go on my contract". To lay any blame at Tigers door seems a bit lame from the outside.

[Stupid]

Listening to the interview it just sounds a bit sad to me. He clearly wants to be first choice wherever he is, willing to take less money to play for Tigers (and fair play to him for that) but not willing to give up on a place in the 1st choice XV.

However, I really don't see how the former can be used against Cockerill now. He can't put Castro above Cole purely on the basis that he could have earnt more elsewhere - if nothing else I'm pretty sure Cole could have got a lot more going elsewhere as well. Equally if he wants Tigers to let him go then it's up to Toulon to pay the release fee. If they said he was free to go, they wouldn't be doing Castro a favour they'd be doing our HC quarter final opponents a favour.

When Castro first turned up, I don't recall White being upset at becoming second choice - and if he was he didn't complain and leave. He could have gone elsewhere, been first choice at his new club and probably could have made more money doing that. But he stuck with the club, even playing into his retirement. Castro has decided not to do that and that's fair enough, but it's hardly Cockerill's fault.

[chipnchase]

I'm very sorry but why are we being so throw away about a great servant to the club.

To say Castro is not as good as he used to be is a load of tosh! He's as good as ever the only difference being Dan Cole has risen to the point of (in some peoples opinions) the best tighthead in world rugby at present. He is a big character around the club and the fans love him!

I dont want to see him go at all but the question is how do you keep two of the worlds best tightheads happy in the same squad.

The cold facts are thats Cockers man management skills are once again about to see another quality player drift away from the club (12 months ago it was Tweelvetrees). The man has created a us and them scenario within his front rows so im not suprised Castro is off as he seems to have been pushed into team B either finishing games or starting lesser ones.

Tigers isnt a club anymore and you can either say 'oh well thats pro rugby' or you can 'hold up a minute we're losing our identity here'. Yes no player is bigger than the club but come on no one wants to see a very large clog in the machine go to a european rival.