Salary cap? What salary cap?

[WiganTiger]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/21018110

It's starting to look like Saracens are now acquiring players that they don't even need, just so they become unavailable to anyone else.

[fortysix]

Can anyone really believe they are adhering to the salary cap !!!!!!????
A finite investigation is needed to how many South African Rand , allegedly and without prejudice, of course, is diverted into relatives bank accounts....
Impossible to comprehend their whole squad only costs 4 million + one standout ......

[Rykard]

esp. when quins have said they couldn't afford to keep JJ with his salary demand..

[Smurphswillgetya]

Hang on a minute, what about Tigers? How can they afford all the internationals they have on their books? Saints owner has often raised this question.

[Skin_and_Muscle]

esp. when quins have said they couldn't afford to keep JJ with his salary demand..

And Vunipola was expected to become one of the higher earners at Wasps.

Hang on a minute, what about Tigers? How can they afford all the internationals they have on their books? Saints owner has often raised this question.

Maybe because he's jealous of Tiger's ability to sign and keep players who are interested in playing rugby (for a top side) and willing to sacrifice the possibility of a higher salary elsewhere to stay - Castro, Cole, Mafi, Parling, and Tait as five examples off the top of my head.

[Dr H Flashman MBE]

Maybe, like Parling, Castro and Cole they all just signed on for less money to win things by playing dynamic and attacking rugby??

[fortysix]

Believe Tigers are not top payers but players realise the beasting they suffer training wise puts them in a different bracket, fitness and mentally.. why tigers are always at the top of the tree...
However the game is progressing -off loading etc and Tigers havent caught up here-yet ??
But we really need a game breaking wing flyer, or two !
I think Morris and Tait are pencilled in full backs, both great value..
But can GM teach Tait to catch a high ball in traffic please ??

[daktari]

Hang on a minute, what about Tigers? How can they afford all the internationals they have on their books? Saints owner has often raised this question.

By having a proper wage structure and not getting into bidding wars, I believe. You would be surprised at the relatively low pay some of the players get, those that have just come up through the academy.

[jgriffin]

There is the example of Tait as to how other clubs treat players -that is to me the real standout of Tigers, player's welfare. It is worth a lot to the players and they have examples such as Tait and Parling to sway their decisions.
Wasn't Manu on about £21K when he got into the 1st XV? I'm sure I read that somewhere!

[WiggoTiger]

Breaking the Salary Cap doesn't buy success...SAffas 1 league title...mmm not that good a return for their alleged indescrections!
Tigers are not top payers but its the clubs aura, fan base and player welfare that usually sways players minds. 12T was after money like Greenwood did and wasn't prepared to fight for his spot in the team!

[daktari]

There is the example of Tait as to how other clubs treat players -that is to me the real standout of Tigers, player's welfare. It is worth a lot to the players and they have examples such as Tait and Parling to sway their decisions.
Wasn't Manu on about £21K when he got into the 1st XV? I'm sure I read that somewhere!

that sounds about for Manu from what I know.

[DickyP]

Interesting article on same subject in the Grauniad.

Having just managed to keep Geoff Parling and the ongoing negotiations with George Ford you realize just how little wriggle-room the DORs of various clubs have. There is the distinct possibility, for instance, that the money we used to keep GP wouldn't have been available if we'd met Billy 12T's demands. (Just me speculating of course as I have no hard facts to go on: always easier to argue from a position of ignorance!)

[mol2]

Unless any club is blatant about "arranging personal sponsorship" it would be a doddle to remain below the salary cap yet have players with combined incomes way beyond the club's salary cap.

Player gets a contract with the club for say £100k. Player arranges personal sponsorship with Sponsor for £200k. The fact that that same sponsor insists that the deal is dependent on playing for club and mysteriously get cheap, prominent advertising at the club by a grateful club.
Effectively this could triple the salary cap or more providing the club have the sponsors to put the players in touch with. There's no paper link between the club and the sponsor. The player's income is private and so long as it's declared to the Inland Revenue there is nothing that the powers that be can do to find out how much a player's income from sources outside of the club is.
He cannot be forced to declare it to the public. It won't be in the club's accounts (which are public) and the sponsor who is likely to have public account's won't necessarily be required to name individuals they pay sponsorship monies too in the accounts submitted. In fact some of the sponsors payments could quite easily appear as payments to foreign companies depending on nationality of the player or more to the point their country of domicile (for tax purposes).

There are as many ways of fudging the salary cap as there are of ways a big earning celebrity can avoid paying tax. Nothing illegal from the tax point of view I hasten to add.

The only thing that caps the salary is how much money the clubs and sponsors have in the coffers. The league salary cap cannot be policed let alone enforced.

[os99]

Hang on a minute, what about Tigers? How can they afford all the internationals they have on their books? Saints owner has often raised this question.

If there wasn't a salary cap, I'm sure the likes of Agulla, Twelvetrees and Tuilagi would have stayed.

[bluntiger]

Player gets a contract with the club for say £100k. Player arranges personal sponsorship with Sponsor for £200k. The fact that that same sponsor insists that the deal is dependent on playing for club and mysteriously get cheap, prominent advertising at the club by a grateful club.

But wouldn't that be fairly obvious to any credible auditor? If, say, a recently retired RSA captain was listed as earning £100K at Saracens and was paid additional salaries through sponsor(s) then would any auditor worth his salt really believe that retired RSA captain would sign to play for £100K? All the other income(s) would be invisible to the salary cap auditor.

If we really believe that is the extent of the salary cap audit, then they may as well save the money of the auditor. An auditors job is to scrutinise, ask questions when things look strange, rationalise salaries, look at fringe benefits etc.

By the way, I have no idea what a recently retired RSA captain is paid, I was using him as an example.