ABC Tiger wrote:I personally don't make a racket whilst a kick is been taken but I don't see why everyone has to be silent for a kick. If there was a scrum and the props decided they need time to concentrate would everyone be quiet then because surely that is the same? Also, in foreign grounds such as France and in the Southern hemisphere there is noise during kicks. I remember watching a Waikato Chiefs match and during a kick a chainsaw was played over the microphone during the kick, so does it matter that much?
The Chiefs don't stay silent during kicks, nor do the French clubs. It's part of their tradition to make a lot of noise, and that's fine. As for being silent at scrumtime, that's never been an issue simply because it's never happened. The jeering of a fullback has always gone on.
ABC Tiger wrote:
I refer you to my earlier post.
The Tigers tradition (and others) is for silence to respect the kickers of both sides.
Others (notably the French) give support to the kickers through a rising crescendo of sound.
Amen. So be it.
It is the sudden interjection in otherwise silence that is totally and completely unnacceptable!!
My point is if at any other point in the game the whole crowd decided to be silent to ensure the players do not lose concentration it would be madness. When a player kicks an up and under and people suddenly shout in the hope that the opposition full back drops it, is that not the same thing? Should we not respect the full backs when catching high balls under pressure as well? I'm not saying it is okay to disrespect opposition (or any) players, I'm just saying why is it crucial we are silent for kicks and not at any other point in the game.
Because we're a club steeped in tradition, of which that is one of them. Other clubs make noise, we stay silent. People coming down to the ground for the first time should be made aware of this IMO, either by the people around them if they're making too much noise, or the people they come with who have been before.
Regardless of this, I'd have thought if you're talking to someone and all of a sudden everyone else goes quiet, you'd automatically do the same, if only because you'd be aware of how loud you sounded.
How many players do you think actually get put off by these noises. The level of concentration they have when taking kicks is immense. They wouldnt notice some idiot blowing a horn.
But really is it that much of an issue? are you expecting the Quins fans to be quiet then next week?
Long may we keep up the tradition of silence during kicks but if the French for one want to make a noise during their own preparations then fine, that's what they do. Bill W is right - it's that sudden noise that might out the kicker off.
But the kickers don't help themselves by taking sooo long to prepare for the difficult task of running up and hoofing the thing as far as possible between two sticks. Farrell is one of the worst offenders and it's a nuisance to wait until he gets that mad stare in his eyes. At least 12T just takes two and a bit steps and biffs it.
Be grateful that the Pirates aren't coming up because it takes their kicker Cook ( I think) an age to to spread his legs wide to the point where he almost falls over, balance himself with his hands going in the other direction, and then stick his rump towards the nearest spectator. The noise you hear from the stands is probably yawning at this point!!
The point is, that a crowd is a collection of individuals who need to each take responsibility for their own actions.
I'm not proud of everything I've done in life. I once ran across a pitch and confronted a giant man who had just brutally taken out our youngest player. A rush of blood to the head and all that.
But he stood there like a man, and later on we had a chat in the bar and I apologised to the referee.
But standing 40 yards away and howling at a bloke who is trying to take a kick is just cowardice.
Kicks and scrums and ruck and roll.....Is all my brain and body need!
DickyP wrote:Unfortunately the forum can't have it both ways - if, as the consensus was, after the Claremont game that it was OK for them to make a racket the same goes when other do as well.
I was less worried about the noise for that kick after a blatant injustice than I was about the oiks who continued as individuals in mainly silent kicks just as the kicker was about to kick.
And before I get attacked by those who quote Claremont's culture etc etc. I quite like the actual thing they do - it's just that coming to WR and doing it is the same as you going to someone's house as a guest and demanding that they watch what you want to on TV. Downright rude.
Clermont only made noise for their own kicker & they were silent during the Tigers kicks - they respected our traditions and didn't put off our kicker, but they made noise and cheered on their own.
No they didn't respect our traditions at all - we are quiet for everybody - if they are making a noise you can't (by definition) hear us being silent so they're being rude. And as I said it's the equivalent of you going to someone's house as a guest and demanding that they watch what you want to on TV. Downright rude!
We traditionally cheer on Leicester. Should they do that when they visit our ground too? Should they have shut up so they could hear us chanting Tigers? Don't be daft. The Clermont fans were spot on, respected our traditions and with the exception of the shooshie brigade we respected theirs.
Having watched the itv highlights again, I can barely hear any noise during the kicks that were shown on TV - OF's miss did not make the highlights show.
Even during the game I would have said that the silence for both kickers was generally well observed (apart from the odd person, who was presumably told to shut up as it did not seem to be the same person twice...)
For myself - I am perfectly quiet when kicks are taken - until something similar to Saturday's events occurs.
Yes, I booed the ref for giving the pen against Chutes.
Yes, I jeered OF for trying to steal a couple of yards.
Yes, I berated the ref for not calling time on the kick as it dragged on & on
(or so it felt in "real" time - may well have been 1.03 minutes as one poster claims, but it felt a lot longer in the stands...)
Yes, I cheered when the kick missed.
Was I trying to put the kicker off ? No I don't think I was.
Am I a bad influence on others ? - I don't think so.
Do I feel the passion of a game and any perceived injustices within it ? Yes I do - that's only normal, isn't it ?
biffer wrote:................
We traditionally cheer on Leicester. Should they do that when they visit our ground too? Should they have shut up so they could hear us chanting Tigers? Don't be daft. The Clermont fans were spot on, respected our traditions and with the exception of the shooshie brigade we respected theirs.
I can't help feeling that you're missing the point - we are talking solely about behaviour during place kicks, not any other phase of the game. Their traditions are great but they are for their patch, and ours are for ours. Our tradition is silence for all kicks. As Sergei would say 'Simples'!
For when the One Great Scorer comes to write against your name,
He marks - not that you won or lost - but how you played the Game."
biffer wrote:................
We traditionally cheer on Leicester. Should they do that when they visit our ground too? Should they have shut up so they could hear us chanting Tigers? Don't be daft. The Clermont fans were spot on, respected our traditions and with the exception of the shooshie brigade we respected theirs.
I can't help feeling that you're missing the point - we are talking solely about behaviour during place kicks, not any other phase of the game. Their traditions are great but they are for their patch, and ours are for ours. Our tradition is silence for all kicks. As Sergei would say 'Simples'!
We're not talking about behaviour during kicks, we're talking about tradition and local custom - as you so regularly point out.
Our tradition is rumbling HEAVE for all rolling malls near the try line - we don't expect other people to do this when visiting - Simples!
All this you can't boo the kickers stuff -or "shhhhing"..then jeeering everthing else that goes on (like screaming at the fullback going in fo a catch or "ironically" cheering the line out thrower etc) just makes supporters look like hypocrites. The worst kind of hypocrites too..sanctimonious hypocrites.
It is a bit of a English supremacists charter.
How many turn up or follow rugby just to "tell off" or :censored: about other supporters (in an attempt to feel superior)?
These quaint rules provide these people that opportunity.
It is all far more unpleasant than just jeering the kicker. I think I prefer the booers. Least they are simply at a pantomime..having a bit of innocent fun for the kids. Putting inbuilt institutionalised sactimoniousness right into your buisness plan - as your USP is far more wretched.
I think we have something here. If Aleksandr appeared with a mike telling the crowd: "This man on peetch is trying to kick eggshapedballamambob through post! Be quiet. Seemples!"
Of course whilst this was being said, Sergei would be scurrying over with the tee.
Kicks and scrums and ruck and roll.....Is all my brain and body need!
I recall reading that players who took penalties / conversions preferred noise (i.e rythmic clapping / drums etc) rather than silence, because with the latter the slightest noise, i.e a shout or heckle, was off-putting. Traditions are important, but I think some Tigers are a little sanctimonious about this. Most silences appear to be broken by the far*s in the corporate areas who don't even observe minute silences whilst guffawing over wine and sandwiches. I don't recall a crucial penalty miss during a noisey period, but I do recall critical misses during total silence - it must unerve the kickers.
All said, it's not really a big problem at Tigers and can easily be snuffed out by parents telling their little oiks to behave, or accidentally pouring a beer over a loudmouth.
If silence isn't expected and there is loads of noise then you can quite easily kick a ball, shoot a pool ball, launch out of your blocks for a 100 metre sprint, chuck a dart, serve a tennis ball, or whatever.
But once silence has descended then any noise sounds awful.
Kicks and scrums and ruck and roll.....Is all my brain and body need!
welshy08 wrote:It is a bit of a English supremacists charter.
I'm happy to go on record as having been (needlessly) 'shushed' and (unnecessarily so as it goes) advised of the 'rugby code' and 'the way it is' by far more persons of Welsh descent than I have by those of English descent.
Faithless is he that says farewell when the road darkens.
