Ben Youngs - citing

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baz1664
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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by baz1664 » Sun Mar 25, 2012 8:54 pm

Just seen it on tv, Youngs did try to give him a slap after being held down, he did drop his knee on him, he will be cited, probably banned between 3-5 weeks, enough said, happy days we won!!

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Tigerbeat » Sun Mar 25, 2012 8:59 pm

I thinl Cockerill said that it was a shin injury. With regards to what happened on the pitch, the Asst Ref said that there was punch thrown and one connected to the face. If this was the case, why did the ref not issue a red card?
I expect the citing officer to look at it and a citing to follow. Ben Youngs may get a ban and needs to learn from it. Lets just wait and see how it is dealt with.
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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Tiger_in_Birmingham » Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:13 pm

The parallels between Youngs and Clark could be quite interesting;

both frustrated by slowing the game down illegally
both after a penalty had been acknowledged (although not necessarily awarded yet)
both could cause serious injury (although only Clark did)

in terms of the laws the only difference I can see if Youngs did it before the referee blew the whistle - there is of course a clear difference in outcome to the players on the receiving end

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Stu_F » Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:49 pm

Stupid & petulant, he will no doubt be cited & banned but hopefully it will teach him a lesson that such behaviour is unacceptable whatever the provocation.

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by snoopster » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:27 pm

Tiger_in_Birmingham wrote:The parallels between Youngs and Clark could be quite interesting;

both frustrated by slowing the game down illegally
both after a penalty had been acknowledged (although not necessarily awarded yet)
both could cause serious injury (although only Clark did)

in terms of the laws the only difference I can see if Youngs did it before the referee blew the whistle - there is of course a clear difference in outcome to the players on the receiving end
From the point of view of the ref, they should be pretty much the same as I understand it.
The disciplinary tribunal take more into account where there are some clear differences -
They do take injury caused into account in the sentence - Youngs seemed to inflict at best very minor injuries, given the victim did play on straight away.
The vulnerability of the victim comes into it as well - Hawkins was face down in pile of bodies and had no chance to defend himself, while the guy Youngs kneed, while on the ground, was looking at Youngs and his body was free (could have either attempted to move out the way or block).
Provocation and premeditation are also factors - Youngs did it during play while still being held, Clark did it after the whistle had gone and Hawkins didn't look be be interfering with him at all which could be seen as rather than reacting in the heat of the moment he was looking to "punish" Hawkins.

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by jgriffin » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:28 pm

I think you're all citing crazy. Get a sense of perspective - BY today nowhere near the Clark/Hawkins nightmare. Some of you need to get down to a real match sometime. Can't believe the rubbish typed here.
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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Tiger_in_Birmingham » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:37 pm

jgriffin wrote:I think you're all citing crazy. Get a sense of perspective - BY today nowhere near the Clark/Hawkins nightmare. Some of you need to get down to a real match sometime. Can't believe the rubbish typed here.
:smt009
Similarly I can't believe the myopic rubbish typed here :smt009

The outcome of the two actions were vastly different but they weren't overly different in terms of players' actions and laws (of the game) broken.

There are magnitudes of difference in outcome but that shouldn't affect if he is cited or not - citing merely says there is a something worth looking.

Maybe BY should only cited had he broken ribs and punctured someone's lungs...

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Smudge » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:44 pm

As the touch judge was standing next to the occurrence and was on hand to
give his verdict. He did not deem it worthy of a yellow let alone a red so
you have to ask the question why would he be cited? He dad seen it all at close
hand.It was not hidden from view, no one was injured except perhaps BY himself
the ref punished it with a reversal of the penalty.
It was dealt with on the field so why on earth can't the stupid pundits and press leave it at that?
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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Tiger_in_Birmingham » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:53 pm

Smudge wrote:As the touch judge was standing next to the occurrence and was on hand to
give his verdict. He did not deem it worthy of a yellow let alone a red so
you have to ask the question why would he be cited? He dad seen it all at close
hand.It was not hidden from view, no one was injured except perhaps BY himself
the ref punished it with a reversal of the penalty.
It was dealt with on the field so why on earth can't the stupid pundits and press leave it at that?
Again Clark was only feet away from the ref and it wasn't judged worthy of a yellow or a red yet people are baying for a 2 year or lifetime ban in some cases

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Daveyboy » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:54 pm

I think it was a silly thing for Ben Youngs to do but the Irish 8 was clearly not inconvenienced by BY's attentions in any way.

I am not calling for BY to be cited - I just think it is a likely turn of events.
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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Smurphswillgetya » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:55 pm

Smudge wrote:As the touch judge was standing next to the occurrence and was on hand to
give his verdict. He did not deem it worthy of a yellow let alone a red so
you have to ask the question why would he be cited? He dad seen it all at close
hand.It was not hidden from view, no one was injured except perhaps BY himself
the ref punished it with a reversal of the penalty.
It was dealt with on the field so why on earth can't the stupid pundits and press leave it at that?
]

So by this logic, since JP Doyle was right there when Clark did what he did and was looking at the players and he took no action then Cockerill and others should have left it at that.
Last edited by Smurphswillgetya on Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Of course this is my own opinion and other posters may have a different perceived factual viewpoint.

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by snoopster » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:56 pm

Smudge wrote:As the touch judge was standing next to the occurrence and was on hand to
give his verdict. He did not deem it worthy of a yellow let alone a red so
you have to ask the question why would he be cited? He dad seen it all at close
hand.It was not hidden from view, no one was injured except perhaps BY himself
the ref punished it with a reversal of the penalty.
It was dealt with on the field so why on earth can't the stupid pundits and press leave it at that?
I don't agree on this - the touch judge said he saw two punches thrown, no mention of the knee which suggests he missed it rather than saw it and didn't think it was worth a yellow. Regardless of that though, the citing officer has to make up his own mind if the knee and punches were worthy of more than just a reversed penalty which is what counts.

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Smurphswillgetya » Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:11 pm

jgriffin wrote:I think you're all citing crazy. Get a sense of perspective - BY today nowhere near the Clark/Hawkins nightmare. Some of you need to get down to a real match sometime. Can't believe the rubbish typed here.
:smt009
Nobody is asking for a citing but discussing the possibility of Ben getting one after his actions. Even you speculated on the Hawkins thread as to whether there would be a citing. Some of us do go to real matches on a regular basis. Why is the BY incident nowhere near the Clark incident. Would you have been happy if Ben's knee had broken a rib and punctured a lung! :smt013
Of course this is my own opinion and other posters may have a different perceived factual viewpoint.

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Brookfield » Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:33 pm

what will be will be. what is particularly interesting is the number of replays showing the Ben Youngs incident. I don't think Sky showed the Clark assault again last Sunday and none of the commentators highlighted it.

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Re: Ben Youngs - possible citing

Post by Smudge » Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:56 pm

Snoopster wrote-:
I don't agree on this - the touch judge said he saw two punches thrown, no mention of the knee which suggests he missed it rather than saw it and didn't think it was worth a yellow. Regardless of that though, the citing officer has to make up his own mind if the knee and punches were worthy of more than just a reversed penalty which is what counts.
But my point is that the TJ stood alongside the two of them on the ground with his flag out. He was on the pitch not three feet away. What was there to miss?
Having clearly seen it (unlike in the LV final) he deemed it not worthy of a card. Look at it again.
I can't believe all this :censored: about wanting him cited.
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