Exeter Chiefs

[bluntiger]

I was shocked to read that despite a sparkling start to the season, Exeter only had 5400 spectators for the opening home game against Newcastle yesterday. That is only half full as Sandy Park capacity is 10744!

[kpb]

Also a very disappointing attendance today at Wasps.Maybe people have lost a bit of interested in the Premiership whilst the World cup is on?

[bluntiger]

Also a very disappointing attendance today at Wasps.Maybe people have lost a bit of interested in the Premiership whilst the World cup is on?

Only just over 5000 at Wasps apparantly. That is genuinely poor! On the Wasps site, their ticket prices have seemingly gone up significantly and if that is the case, what a stupid decision that is!

[Old Hob]

I thought the theory was that the WC would raise the profile of the game and so MORE people would be interested. A Glos chap was bewailing the fact that their season ticket sales are still only 5 or 6 thousand.

[bluntiger]

Chiefs tickets are more expensive than ours.A lot of their support is conditional - e.g. full for Tigers, Saffas, HC etc but nowhere near it otherwise. 5000 is a big improvement on their Championship attendances.

I understand what you are saying JG, but this is the best period in their club's history, a great start to the season and their first home game of the season and only 5400 turn up. Great start for Wasps too and they only get 5000 for their first home game.

It is not like they have a lot of sports competition in the surrounding area.

[salcombe bob]

Chiefs are possibly the most expensive to go to see, £26 to stand.Also, they are doing well partly because they have lost no-one to the WC as the three that have gone were all summer signings.
They are chuffed the fixtures have given them us, Saints, and Sarries whilst the WC is on!! Annoying.

[bluntiger]

Chiefs are possibly the most expensive to go to see, £26 to stand.Also, they are doing well partly because they have lost no-one to the WC as the three that have gone were all summer signings.
They are chuffed the fixtures have given them us, Saints, and Sarries whilst the WC is on!! Annoying.

I hear all that, but 5400 for their opening game of the season! Wasps too, only 5000, they must both be losing a fortune even if they have not spent up to the salary cap.

Saracens usually only get around 7000 and have said that with their squad that means they lose £3-4M each year so Chiefs and Wasps, with smaller playing budgets, must be losing £2-3M+ each year. Do Exeter have someone who can absorb those kind of losses?

[Jay C]

I hear all that, but 5400 for their opening game of the season! ... they must be losing a fortune even if they have not spent up to the salary cap.

Saracens usually only get around 7000 and have said that with their squad that means they lose £3-4M each year so Chiefs and Wasps, with smaller playing budgets, must be losing £2-3M+ each year. Do Exeter have someone who can absorb those kind of losses?

I'm sure Exeter have done their sums and have priced their tickets accordingly !

I'm hypothesising, but just for fun :
1. We expect that Saffas spend up to the salary cap (and more!), whereas Chiefs are probably spending less than £2m. So say -£2.2m difference including NI.
2. Saffas rent their ground, whereas Chiefs own theirs and will therefore have potential for additional income, whereas Saffas have to pay just to play... -£0.5m.
3. Saffas put on at least one game a season at Twickers, which I'm guessing does not make any money either .... maybe even a loss leader for them -0.1m.
4. Not sure about sponsorship - personally I wouldn't spit on a saffas shirt, let alone pay to be on one ! - but lets say monies even on that one. £0m.
5. Less fans at Chiefs, but higher prices - call it evens again. £0m.
6. Prize money / European rugby - I'm sure I read somewhere a quote by Cockers a while back that said that even Tigers lose out financially the further they go in the HC competition, so that's more money cost to Saffas -0.3m.

I'm sure I'm more than way out on some of the numbers, & I've also missed lots of other things that could be significant, but on these six simple examples - if Saffas are losing £3m each year - then Chiefs could still be around breakeven in comparison.....

[Grimlish]

jgriffin wrote:

Economics is a dismal pseudo-science because the vagaries of human perception can confound the bean counters' prediction.

Ooh err, how philosophical!

fwiw

1) Isnt that what makes Economics interesting?
2) The neuro-scientists are trumping both the bean-counters and the traditional economists by taking us to 'behavioural economics' and 'neuro-economics', which are begining to give us a version of economics that works in the 'real world'.

I'm waiting for the day when we get 'neuro-rugby'....

[Grimlish]

Agree with most of that, altho we could debate the place of heuristics in bounded chaos as a (predictive) 'model' for the world of rugby....

(and if behavioural science is ever successfully applied to the field of economics I for one would be delighted....!)

[bluntiger]

I read recently that Saracens' financial position is worse that had been expected. They reported a loss last year of £6.4M and admitted that the Wembley jaunts actually contributed to the losses!

50% of that loss is shouldered by Nigel Wray and 50% by their South African benefactors.

'South African billionaire Johann Rupert may have invested heavily into the club however last years accounts reveal an eye-watering £6.4 million. Some suspicious minds may accuse Sarries of playing fast and loose with the wage cap, but Wray strongly denies that.

"I have heard that said about so many clubs. We are paying as much as we can up to the wage cap because that is the rule. 50% comes from our South African investors and 50% comes from me. If you nip down to Toulon like we did the other day, well it is a different dimension which probably means that the wage cap cannot last."

I am assuming that they mean an eye-watering £6.4M LOSS.