England No. 8

[vin rouge]

I know a lot of discussion has gone into the England centre partnership not being up to scratch but I have felt for some time that Nick Easter is not a world class player either.

In my view he is a decent premiership player but is a one trick pony and somewhat of a carthorse. He is lothagic, plodding and predictable and rarely actually breaks the gain line at an international level. He does suck defenders in well as often two people tackle him so you could argue he creates room outside, and he does the odd thing ok, but little really well and i think any No. 8 worth their salt could do this.

I don't have an answer to the problem- maybe Easter is the best 8 we have (i hope not!) but would be interested in the thoughts of others.

possile back row: Moody- 7, croft- 6 haskell-8? although I'm not sure haskell is reliable enough?

[Jay C]

Defensively he puts in more than his share - Haskell at 8 would not

[vin rouge]

maybe but what's the best thing you can say about Easter- i'm pretty sure it's not that great whatever it is

[tb1]

I think Feaster is pretty good actually. If he was a better athlete he would be a top player.

[bluntiger]

If you use Pierre Spies or even Fernandez-Lobbe as the worldclass benchmark, then you are right, he is definitely not world class offensively or defensively.

But that is not the point. Is he the best that is available? Probably. Crane? Dowson? Haskell? None would offer a serious improvement.

[bwightman]

Easter is absolutely nailed-on as our 8 until the end of the WC. Perhaps Johnno will look at bringing in new blood at the base of the scrum after that. If he does there are a few options to consider:

Phil Dowson - a big, fast 8 who's already in the wider training squad. He turns 30 during the WC, so as he's only 3 years younger than Easter age isn't exactly on his side.

James Haskell - he's played remarkably well so far this 6N! The ! is well merited as usually he's a complete gym orc, but he's surprised pretty much everyone with measured, physical and intelligent contributions in 2011. I'm not sure he'll ever display the consistency to make the white No.8 shirt his own though.

Jordan Crane - need a MASSIVE end to the season to force his way back into the reckoning. It's been far too stop-start for him to be anywhere near the radar this season and there are plenty of guys ahead of him on Johnno's list; you can be sure of that. A big unit with a footballer's brain (not in the unkind sense), he's an 8 through and through, which you can't say for the others. He's the youngest of the three and, to be honest, he's got the most room for development and improvement.

I think come next year's 6N we will be looking at a straight fight between Crane, Croft, Easter, Haskell and Tom Wood for the 4 matchday shirts. You can't really grumble at that either! It's good to be English again.

On the subject of Easter, he's probably the best natural rugby player in the squad at the moment. Ok, he may be more of a G&T man than a gym fanatic but he runs hard, offloads, gets his hands beyond the tackle and provides a stable fulcrum for the forwards to rally around as good as anyone else in the country at the moment. With the WC this close it'd be a brave man who'd usurp him in favour of someone else.

[bwightman]

If you use Pierre Spies or even Fernandez-Lobbe as the worldclass benchmark, then you are right, he is definitely not world class offensively or defensively.

Spies! Someone mentioned the phrase "one-trick pony" earlier and now here's the posterboy himself. Spies has to be the most overrated backrower in world rugby. He has no defensive game (more often than not injures himself when he accidently ends up in the line), can't ruck, can't run a line off someone's shoulder and - contrary to SA propaganda - drops more balls in the act of scoring than a leper on a cold day. He's massive and ridiculously quick, but that's where it ends for Spies. Should have converted to a winger, except his shocking lack of game prevented him from doing that.

I know I'm going to get shot down for that (probably quite rightly too) but Spies' near Herculean status (if you believe the hype) has been a pet hate of mine for ages. Ryan Kankowski's the real hero!

[adamv6]

I know I'm going to get shot down for that (probably quite rightly too) but Spies' near Herculean status (if you believe the hype) has been a pet hate of mine for ages. Ryan Kankowski's the real hero!

Not from me you're not! I couldn't agree more, Kankowski on a bad day in twice the player that Spies is.

IMHO, the best #8 in the world for the past fews years has been Parisse. A few years back when the rumour mill went into overdrive that he was coming to Tigers, I nearly soiled my undies with excitement. Unfortunately, rumours were all it turned out to be.

I hope Crane gets a good end of season under his belt, as I don't rate Haskell or Dowson at 8. Narraway has been playing really well at Gloucester, and doesn't get a mention anymore, but again, I don't think he is a true out and out 8.

[Tiger_Dad]

We can't expect to have world class in every position but Easter is quality.

I can't see what the issue is. More often that not he gives England go forward ball, his support play is excellent and his defence rarely lets the team down. I recon he's one of the first on Johno's team sheet.

By all accounts he's an influential/ lead character in the camp and will be one of Johno’s captains in the WC.

[westwinds31]

If Crane returns and produces the form of a couple of months ago, he'll certainly be in the reckoning. Whilst he hasn't the footballing nous of Thomas Waldrom, he is consistently over the gain line and off-loads more than some of the posts on here would have him off-load !

[mol2]

I've never been an Easter fan but have to say he has been one of the most improved of the England side in the 6N.
Who are the alternatives?
Crane can't get into the Tigers' starting 15 at present and whilst England have a number of rather good back row players to choose from few are true No8s.

Barring injury he's cemented his place for the WC. After that England should move on to a younger player.

[G.K]

If you want to play 5 yard Rugby then he'll do as long as someone can explain the offside situation to him at rucks and mauls.

[Ian Cant]

Easter is a very good number 8 as is Crane. When you take both out of their club sides they struggle. Crane always makes a difference to us. You only have to look at how he won us the Premiership against London Irish and he gives us more control at the back of the scrum. With him Croft and The Tank we have an awesome backrow. Easter is similar for England- not dynamic(Like Deacon!!) but take him out and England(Quins) lose out on stout defence and grunt in attack.

[westwinds31]

mol2...the reason Crane can't get into the Tigers starting line up, is he's been injured.

[Blabyboy]

parrise best in world, would get into any team, pure class,
easter, best on offer..........for now !!