The Haka, and other challenges

[Bill W (2)]

Personally I think it should stop, it is no more traditional than swing Low, and many ex players in NZ themselves find it problematic.

I think mass V-signs would be the appropriate English response.

Tut, tut, tut!!!

You will dissapprove of the Irish having two national anthems next!!

[TigerS2]

I would be happy if anthems would be sung without bliddy opera singers.

[G.K]

I'd be happy if we stopped all this nationalistic stuff and just gon on with the Rugby! Our Royalist dirge makes me cringe anyway.

[BJ.]

I would be happy if anthems would be sung without bliddy opera singers.

I couldn't agree more. When are these wannabes going to realise they are meant to be singing a national anthem and not giving a 2-minute concert?

[DickyP]

Personally I think it should stop, it is no more traditional than swing Low, and many ex players in NZ themselves find it problematic.

I think mass V-signs would be the appropriate English response.

Tut, tut, tut!!!

You will dissapprove of the Irish having two national anthems next!!

Let's be accurate - the Irish don't have 2 national anthems: they play the national anthem of the country in which they play their home game, plus "Ireland's Call" which was adopted to avoid the anomaly of the Irish team representing two countries. If they ever play in Belfast again then they will play God Save the Queen.

[kevf]

How would people react to booing and jeering during the singing of the national anthems? These are similar symbolic rituals. And how do people feel about the crowd at Minellium Stadium shouting and jeering during the two minutes silence?

Surely the same logical response ought to be given to them all; though I guess many rugby fans aren't in a logical state of mind when they watch rugby. The drink and the emotions take over, sadly.

disagree... each country has its national anthem.. and quiet is observed during each... the haka is a war chant basically come and have a go if you think your hard enough...

if they want us to treat respond in a way traditional to the haka... well why don;t they tell us how.. or do they just think we should stand meekly ready for defeat..

[Kinoulton]

This may be a hare & tortoise race in the quest for tolerance.

Football, which is obviously the tortoise and is miles behind rugby in terms of decency, but is none-the-less making deliberate strides. The French national anthem at Wembley was respectfully observed by a full crowd of mainly English football supporters. That wouldn't have happened three years ago.

Newcastle fans who'd just watched their team being tonked 5-1 away at Bolton rose, as a man, to their feet and applauded all 22 players off the pitch.

Meanwhile us rugby fans are :censored: about a haka which is just a bit of enjoyable theatre. The Welsh boo "Swing Low". What's up with us?

[Roadsweeper]

First Haka I saw was the Midland v's AB's at Welford Road 1979 or 1980 fantastic entertainment, crowd watched it then went wild.

After AB's had beaten us, I got on the pitch with my dad and we walked past Billy Bush, he was a mountain man.

Now we just see it too often, AB's here every year, on the TV all the time, sparkle has gone from it.

Nevertheless, shut up watch it then respond by shouting like a mad thing for your team for the next 80 mins

[SaltyJackTar]

Nevertheless, shut up watch it then respond by shouting like a mad thing for your team for the next 80 mins

Well said Roadsweeper. Spot on.

[BJ.]

Has anyone ever wondered why the ABs usually have a good opening period in their games? The opposition has stood around for a while listening to two songs (three if they're Irish) and then they are expected to stand still whilst the New Zealanders keep warm by slapping their thighs and waving their arms about.

It takes the opposition 10 minutes to get properly warmed up again!

[Kinoulton]

This is a good theory BJ.

Very experienced jockeys have a habit of causing their nutacse equines to "act up" before a race. Consequently all the other horses and riders get loaded and spend ages in the stalls freezing their b******s off (including Claire Balding), and then the experineced jockey finally brings his horse in, the stalls open instantly and his excitable nag is off to a flyer.

Any road up, could we not do away with the pre-match sh*te altogether? National anthems which half the team cannot or will not sing, impatient players being introduced to dignitaries they don't wish to meet, the obligatory minute's silence because there's always someone that's died somewhere.....

It's not crowd pleasing, the players hate it, and the TV companies talk all over it.

Why bother?

[Bill W (2)]

Why bother?

'Tis tradition!

And nowt wrong with it!

Mind you I do get bored with the firework displays!!

[TigerS2]

This may be a hare & tortoise race in the quest for tolerance.

Football, which is obviously the tortoise and is miles behind rugby in terms of decency, but is none-the-less making deliberate strides. The French national anthem at Wembley was respectfully observed by a full crowd of mainly English football supporters. That wouldn't have happened three years ago.

Newcastle fans who'd just watched their team being tonked 5-1 away at Bolton rose, as a man, to their feet and applauded all 22 players off the pitch.

Meanwhile us rugby fans are about a haka which is just a bit of enjoyable theatre. The Welsh boo "Swing Low". What's up with us?

...............
The French anthem is fantastic.

[mightymouse]

I think Kinoulton is almost right here - it is all just gone crazy

I've paid to watch a match not all that nonsense

If you want to see some tradtional stuff then do it to entertain the crowd prior to the arrival of the players

I seem to recall a Zulu war dance in Durban on the lions tour in '97 - It was all very thrilling and I think I have a few photos .. but it all happened long before the players pitched up

I don't mind a few pipers marching up and down at Murrayfield to get you in the mood but please don't start parading around in front of the players.

I can just about cope with a national anthem if they speed it up (1 verse not 2 and certainly not 2 blasted songs) . but all this other milarky quite frankly get's on my wick when i'm in the mood for a match and if I was about to play i would be chewing my arm off if I had to put up with that nonsense prior to playing.

Those countries with 2 songs .. choose ONE. and as for the All Blacks silly dance - if they want to do it, have it instead of their anthem, not both.

Believe me I am a traditionalist when it comes to rugby, I have been watching and or playing now for over 40years but the Haka is out of control and bears no resemblance to what it started out as so let's knock it on the head and get on with the game

If they continue to insist on it then they have no right to insist on how anyone else responds to it but I think if I was playing I would respond in different ways each time

1st time stand laughing at them and mock copying i- t 2nd time sit in the changing room in indifference - 3rd time, go up to the far end behind the goal line igore it and carry on doing you own warm up

- Do anything but certainly NOT respect it or have anything to do with their manipulation of your actions!

[Kinoulton]

I think Kinoulton is almost right here

Praise indeed!

Can I add that I would remove the national anthem, flag waving, and medal pinning nonsense from all competitions? It's just embarrassing. Some bloke is expecting to chuck his hammer, 8 nervous women are psyching themselves up for a 200 metre sprint, and suddenly we all have to stop for a medal ceremony with regards to an event that happened yesterday. All rise for Azerbaijan national anthem.

And as for motor racing thickheads who spray proper Champagne at their mates, words fail me.

Cannot rugby take the lead in saying: teams out, show respect for each other, kickoff, game on.

End of game, applaud your opposition, acknowledge the crowd warmly, job done.