George at the England v Baa Baas Game

[simon redshaw]

Not sure if any else of you saw but when the presentation of souvenuirs was being made to the Baa Baas, the camera panned down the crowd in that stand, and George was luming large. Don't know how many other of our players were watching but certainly Chutes was there to be seen.

I didn't actually see the game as watching something else bu sounds like dire England performance and Baa Baas nearly won.

[Bad Wolf]

I saw Harry Ellis and Jordan Crane sat together during the match.

[Dave Angel]

I was there at the game.

It wasn't a dire performance at all! Not a classic but the England v Barbarians games rarely are thanks to the scratch nature of BOTH sides & it was certainly better, more entertaining fare than the Tigers v Wasps game the day before.


Yes, the Barbarians nearly won but they have won 4 of the previous 7 matches between the two sides & they had FAR more international experience than the England side who were shorn of their Tigers, Wasps & Bath players.


England played well & showed promising signs for the (near) future, especially given the selection limitations they were faced with for this one-off match.

The 55,000 crowd all seemed to enjoy it & in the end England managed to edge a tight, exciting game against an experienced opposition.

It definitely wasn't "dire"!


(Oh, and Chutes was probably there along with the rest of the Churchill Cup & NZ tour squads as they are all flying out to their respective tour destinations today I think).

[simon redshaw]

Well obviously you have a better view of the game Dave then both Sky and maybe the papers. As Sky certainly made out England's performance to be awful both online and on the programme. Would have to do much better when facing All Blacks etc, although did say ABs had their problems too.

I didn't see the game so no other comment on whether it was better then Saturday's game although don't think GP Final was poor. Maybe not a classic though due top Wasps domination in the first half.

I will say that the closeness of the game made it a better game for spectators and neutrals in competitiveness but not sure by what I heard that it was as good a game as you are making it out to be, Dave. 55000 is a good crowd considering it was the day after GP final and it was a Sunday.

Agree that the Barbarians had more international experience then England short of Leicester and Wasps players. Is there a case for not scheduling these games at same time as or just after the GP or Heineken Final?

That's true, Chutes and others would have been there as part of Saxons side leaving today for North America.

Great that Harry Ellis and Jordan Crane were there too.

[Chobbsy]

Not sure if any else of you saw but when the presentation of souvenuirs was being made to the Baa Baas, the camera panned down the crowd in that stand, and George was luming large. Don't know how many other of our players were watching but certainly Chutes was there to be seen.

I didn't actually see the game as watching something else bu sounds like dire England performance and Baa Baas nearly won.

Both teams were dire

[simon redshaw]

I think that might be a fairer reflection on the game Chobbsy, judging by what I heard. They didn't sound overly enamoured by the Barbarians play, too.

[Dave Angel]

Simon, I actually had an almost identical view of the game to the press as I was sitting only a couple of rows behind them yesterday!


As you say, you didn't actually see the game. I agree with the comment that England will have to do much better when facing the ABs but I can assure you that yesterday's team won't be anything like the 22 taking on New Zealand in the first Test. For a start, yesterday's entire front row was uncapped! That won't happen against New Zealand.

Also, England were forced to make a few changes as the game wore on thanks to injuries to both Hodgson & Flood that left them with no real kickers on the pitch.




And Simon, on your final point about if there was a case for the game to be played at another time, I'm afraid that's a non-starter.

Playing it any earlier would mean playing it mid-season and players missing yet another GP match for England duty.

Playing it any later would mean playing it AFTER the summer tours & that would mean extending the mandatory rest period for the players further into the start of the new GP season, not to mention how difficult it would be to pull together a Barbarians opposition in the middle of everyone's summer break!

[RayDTuTu]

I thought the game was dire.
The game served no real purpose except to injure some players at the end of a long season
I also thought that some of the Ba-ba's players were a disgrace.
Let's face it a lot of them were older players at the end of their careers with not much to lose.
They were tackling illegally and were constantly offide (probably because they are no longer fast enough to keep up!)
They seem to get away with it far too often just because of the nature of what the team is supposed to stand for.
They did not play attractive rugby in the traditional sense (they even kicked and missed their first penalty)
The only thing that was traditional (or old school) was the violence.
I think it is time to scrap the end of season Ba-bas game.

[simon redshaw]

Well, I don't quite agree with your assessment of the game, although I only rely on the bias old sky etc for that game.

Your reasoning for the date if game played is impeccable as ever.

However, there is one other solution to not play the game at all. It was just a money spinner for the RFU as I see it. It wasn't necessary. Most of the players weren't available and those that were didn't seem to be up for it.

That so many turned up is very good, as it was a shadow England side in effect.

[Dave Angel]

Simon, I agree that the other option is not to play the game at all as it is a money spinner but don't forget that it is this money that is re-invested into the grassroots of the game & the same money that is being paid to the clubs/PRL as part of the new Club/Country agreement.


If they didn't have money-spinners like this to raise revenuesomeone would probably only complain that the RFU weren't investing enough in grassroots rugby!

It's one of those things that someone from one side or the other will always disagree with whatever the outcome!

[TTRITH]

NExt season is the Baa Baas game going to be on the same weekend again?

If so, who will have the choice of players due to this club country agreement

[Dave Angel]

If it on the same weekend again, clubs will still have first call on the players & England will take those that are left as this is a non-cap friendly.


I'd be far more concerned about which players will be missing due to the Lions Tour than which ones may play against the Barbarians.

[Nic]

I was lucky enough to get hold of some good tickets via John Wells (thanks) and sat next too Jordan Crane Ollie Smith and near Chuter, they were there to tour with the Saxons as were quite a few others. I didn't see Harry Ellis.
The game live was entertaining and hard fought not a classic but not boring, the England boys put in alot of effort,at the end many of the Baa's looked like they had been in a contest too.
Plenty more rugby like that where England ar e headed

[bradge]

I was genuinely taken aback by Dave Angel's comments. Just goes to show the truth in the phrase "one man's meat is another man's poison" I thought the standard of play on both side's was dire in a game that was made worse by the standard of refereeing. A total borefest, after which I totally regretted not spending the previous two hours doing something infinitely more exciting - tending my garden.
I found the Ireland v Ba Bas game a delight by comparison.

[Tiger Eye]

Haha yeah I saw George gawking right into the camera, he looked unsure whether or not to smile!