entering a welsh golden era?

[Bill W]

An era is supposed to last 30 years!

The current Welsh one is unlikely to last 3 weeks!

[Pete]

Bill you are too harsh.

Wales have won three matches in a row.
For them, that is a golden era!

[seaweed]

Oh I do hope there are a few getting thier spoons out on the 15th March for some nice humble pie.

Failing that I shall wait for our next golden era next season !!

[burly bill mclaren]

BBM, it must be wonderful in your world! Despite the fact that the regions are showing promise at the moment, if you only have 4 players competing for 1 position, where's the drive? Where are the youngsters going to get game-time for experience? We'll see what happens with the regions in the future - there was an article in the Times (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/ ... 414706.ece) the other day written by Stephen Jones and quoting Keith Wood bemoaning the fact that there is very little talent coming through or that that is is not being given the chance to shine!

You'll probably now go on to bemoan the Premiership and the influx of foreigners in the premiership BUT we have 12 teams in the prem, you only 4 (well, 3 and a half really), the irish the same and the Scots a measly 2. If Johnny Foreigner (and in that I'm including Welsh, Scots and Irish)comes into the prem to play that still leaves 11 English qualified players in that position (this is where you'll now nit-pick and pull up some position where 10 or 11 foreigners are playing) but if it happens one of the celtic regions (Like Justin Marshall for example) then that leaves only 3 Welshmen fighting for the same position! See the problem here? There's also the fact that (apparently) no player playing outside of wales will be considered for selection!! Ridiculous!! The best scrum half in Wales is going to Sale so he's now going to be ignored totally?? Wise move that! That's why I'm predicting a(nother) false dawn!

2 games, 2 wins and every Welshman/woman/cat/dog/sheep comes out of the closet and goes on and on and on about "The Dragon being back!" or "Golden Eras" or something of a similar ilk!

I sincerely thank you muttley for a genuine thought out respo9nse. i sort of agre with some and partly disagree with other bits. i do take issue you you trying to second guess my response

welsh regional rugby is a new concept in wales. so obviously the entire p[roject takes years to bed in fully. the umpteen age levels rregional sides that underp[in in produce most of the talent now and not just the clubs as before.

in order to optimise the age group regional levels it takes a vast amount of time, money and coaches as well as the facilities. we now see a large number of top players going into coaching long term. this is a huge long term change. the structure allows this now and it is more financially affordable due to the seperation of pro from semi pro from amateur rugby

now we see dozens of ex welsh internationals go into coaching this is a great thing

re your point about not picking players outside wales that is not true. peel will be selected as has bene publicly stated. what has been inferred is those outsie wales may have their test hopes slighly hurt by rugby politics as many will not be released on certain dates for training or test matches outside the international window. it is not a closed shop as in new zealand. it is a middle ground. gareth thomas for example had endless problems in toulopuse getting released for training and some tests

as for the numbers issues in wales there is an agreement between wru and 4 regions to keep limit on overseas players. in cases where a region may step beyond the limit of 5 or 6 then the WRU sits on the panel and adjudicates the merits of its worth to welsh rugby as the WRU fund the regions yto the tune of £10 million plus. the bottom line is everyone is on board with the fact they want welsh players and also limited but quality overseas superstars like rush, holah, king, tiatia, lomu, teichmann, marshall etc

in terms of those who cant get a contract in wales or choose to leave like lee thomas, eifion roberts, cheeseman, luscombe, delve, mefin davies, horsman, morris, bonner evans, llewellyn, strange etc they still play elite rugby and as weve seen if they show form they can get picked as delve is now

the issue of marshall and phillips at same side is a fair one. they do alternate and phillips gets a lot of game time so its not too damaging and what he learns off the record capped all black must be massive every day. the ospreys only had 4 non welsh at start of season the other 34 are welsh

in terms of how many are exposed to elite european rugby then in wales the 4 squads of 38 totals 152 players of which approx 16/17 are non welsh thats 136 players in heineken cup. plus the approx 12 in the heineken in england= 148. nearly all of which are challenging for test rugby. journeymen or retired welsh internationals are let go

in england there are 7 sides x 38 players = 266 players exposed to elite competition , less approx 85 non english players. thats approx 181 left plus a few abroad.

the difference in numbers exposed to elite competition is not that big. plus the sheer quality. in wales its almost entirely players still challenging for test rugby. in england its a greater variety of some up and comers, some greats and many many journeymen

the other advantage in wales is the players are used to playing together and that can be hugely beneficial at test level. below the regions is a healthy club system in which the wru are demanding improvements on and off the field

the academies/centres of excellence are all on their way now at llanelli, newport, vale of glamorgan, bridgend and newport. this will have a great effect on standards

the key to this is how cloesly the regions and wru work together with longer term goals in mind. its harder to keep that unity in england with so many more teams, agendas, money and so on. england though is vibrant and competitive and neither model is perfect

most traditionalists wanted to keep club rugby as it was. But this new model similar to that in new zealand makes far more economic sense. less is more
but Id still hope to see a 5th region one day representing the valleys and the north. the WRU though seem more fixated on bringing london welsh into the celtic league. we'll see

[Bill W]

Bill you are too harsh.

Wales have won three matches in a row.
For them, that is a golden era!

Thanks Pete! Now I understand!

[Crumby]

BBM as i've indicated in previous posts - so your regional side is not competitive in Europe (£ out of 4)you need immediate strength the club wants to import S/H players the WRU says no - result big attendances to watch uncompetetive sides.
http://www.tigers.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20906
see the above -english clubs were first now Ireland and france are feeling the effect, i'm afraid Wales are just lagging behind a little.

[Boland]

jgriffin are you having a laugh,how can you say the welsh will allways be vulnerable to a good tight game.England will allways be vulnerable to a good open game,i know which type of game i would prefere,and thats not the boring,boring game england play.Just watch us play and learne from it ,we turned the pressure on you second half and you couldnt handle it.

[Big Dai]

My Rugby teacher, A Welshman, always used to say it's a simple game. When it's you going forward carry on, if your mate's going forward support him with what skill you have AND HOLD ON TO THE PILL.

They can't play without the ball and can't run without their legs. Simple!

Therefore anyone can be vulnerable to a good tight game. Boring though that may be......to some.

Wales have profited well from the mistakes of others and when the chaos has descended. Created?? The jury is out.

I feel like many on here, the test is yet to come.

[creos]

Chance of a Welsh grand slam in 2008... medium

based on the following:

Wales beating Italy more effectively than Ireland or France, mainly on the back of a strong second half performance that neither Ireland nor France had.

France again having a poor second half this time against England. 3 poor second halves in a row for France, I don't think they'll beat Wales.

Which means the big match is Ireland against Wales, Murphy is playing well and the Irish backs are getting forward but unfortunately I think this will just mean if Wales can win the ball there should be space for their backs to exploit.

A

[Pete]

Great results from the Welsh regional teams last night!

[tigerstotty]

Wales haven't played well - their opposition has just played worse. Both Ireland and France will hammer them.

[SamWard]

I'm confused. A new "Golden Era" of Welsh Rugby? I've only been alive to see two real so-called "Golden Eras", and that was England and the All-Blacks.
In both cases, the teams absolutely dominated anyone they played. The All-Blacks probably still will. The Welsh on the other hand... When both the English and the All-Blacks played badly, they still (most of the time) won. When Wales played badly, i.e first half against England and Fiji (RWC), they were put to the sword. Well, not so much by England, but you get the picture.
When England were on top of the world, their second 15 could have probably been runners-up at the World Cup in 2003. New Zealand's second 15 got to the quater-finals in last year's World Cup, and their firsts should have won it from there on. But, one bad game (which they almost won) cost them. Oh well.
Wales on the other hand, didn't make it as far as the knockout rounds, and doubtless their second 15 would have gotten anywhere.
One win against England does NOT mean you are in a "Golden Era"; unless you are Bosnia-Herzgovnia, or any other low ranked team. Wales will not win the Grand Slam. The French didn't beat England because England have a world class pack. Wales do not. France will most probably have Wales for breakfast, and win the championship on, at the very least, points difference. It would suprise me if Wales beat Ireland.
When Wales can start beating teams like Ireland and France, and then in the autumn beat one of the SH teams without a struggle, then Wales could start to really shine.
But, when Mr. Gatland doesn't win the championship this year, who knows if he'll live to see the autumn?

[HerbertJ]

Surely, you shouldnt really be talking about Golden era's until you've beaten atleast 2 southern hemispehere teams, probably at the moment having to include South Africa as one of the two beaten.

How short the memory to an early world cup exit??

Unless of course, the implication is that a Welsh team in a golden era still wouldnt be the best team in the world

Although, i think this is particularly offensive to previous great welsh teams..

[Bill W]

Not looking good for an era!

http://www.rfu.com/index.cfm/fuseaction ... ryID/19192