England Captain

[Big Dai]

......or to ask Jonny to play out of position and put the newcomer in his true position when the injuries happened?

20 20 hindsight!

[fferm buttocks]

James Haskell top lad, why wasn't he picked for the RWC can any one remind me? Welcome to the forum No 6 flanker !!

[Bill W]

Jonny won us the world cup in 2003. Actually he didn't - he was bailed out by Mike Catt and set up to drop the goal by Johnno. He is a faily mediocre club level fly half.

Today how many clean breaks did he make? none! How many cut out passes did he deliver? none! How many line breaking pop passes did he make? none!

[fferm buttocks]

Well even tho' I'm half welsh and half english, and so I was happy with the win by the under dog, I still want England to do well or win !! So ... let us neve forget the world cup and that England prefer to improve rather than sustain.

[Bearded.Biker]

Having slept on it I still got up this morning totally bemused at the way England imploded and am sitting here trying to understand why!

Getting back the the theme of this thread, is it me, or the shoddy camera work displayed by the BBC (please no - not the start of another diversion), that at no time saw the Captain urging on 'his' team.

How many times in the past have we seen Cozza verbally laying into them when things were going wrong and encouraging them when they were doing well. Johnno was the same and so was Dayglo (but then he was always going on anyway).

To me Vickery does not display the passion that a Captain requires to fulfill the role. The ones that do for me at present are Regan - if he could concentrate his efforts towards his own team rather than baiting the opposition - Mad Dog, Borthwick and Kay.

Apart from these I personally do not see any stand out 'generals' in the squad that have the charisma to lead our team AND would be by right the first name penciled in on the team sheet. Please let me be wrong.

[masopa]

Tricky given the options are:

1) "Experienced" heads who, it seems, can't organise their way out of a paper bag;
2) Players who aren't even the best in their position; and
3) Injured players.

Not good, really. If fit I'd be tempted by Moody. Alternatively if Lewsey ever makes a reappearance he'd be another possibility (although leading from FB is tricky).

Kay could but then he might not be first choice 5 anyway.

[kevf]

my take on this.

in any team your captain on the field has to be 1 first name on the team sheet and second able to last 80 misn barring injury... he also nees to be able to lead...

also your tight head is a very important choice.. he will direct the scrums... in vickery we have a decent tight head but thats it... we need 2 out of three..

second on the team sheet no 10 he needs to be able to direct the game... JW doesn't seem to be able to do that... he's not the linch he was... maybe we need a decent 12... flood is ok but again they are playing for an average premiership team...

your full back also crucial needs to have a decent boot on him more from the hand than the ground... and be able to make a decsion and be the last line of tackiling... balshaw didn't.

Ok fpor what its worth i think we are stucvk with roughly this team for the 6N and until ashton gets a kicking or is sacked the team need to do what they did in the WC... we casn't do the grand slam or the triple but we can still put up a good showing and win the 6N..... so they need to have a long hard look at themselves and work out what they want to do... because in my eyes and i hope there own eyes yesterday was unacceptable, we are a better team thatn the second half showed.. we should have closed it first half...

Wales on the other hand were not brilliant but stuck to their guns but i notice they improved once they got rid of some of the ospreys and brought blues and scalets players into the mix...

both teams have a long way to go to improve.. lets see what next week brings... we need to put 40 points on italy

[Dave J]

What Ashton should do is name his best XV and then make one of them captain. By naming Vickery as captain he is obliged to pick him even when he is clearly not the best at his position.

[TTRITH]

best XV IMO:

15. Lewsey
14. Sackey
13. Hipkiss
12. Tait
11. Varndell
10. Wilkinson
9. Ellis
1. Sheriden
2. Mears
3. Stevens
4. Deacon
5. Shaw
6. Croft
7. Moody
8. Crane

now, which one out of them would be a decent skipper?? Shaw wouldnt last 80mins and Wilko drops after 60 mins??

[SkippyTiger]

best XV IMO:

15. Lewsey
14. Sackey
13. Hipkiss
12. Tait
11. Varndell
10. Wilkinson
9. Ellis
1. Sheriden
2. Mears
3. Stevens
4. Deacon
5. Shaw
6. Croft
7. Moody
8. Crane

now, which one out of them would be a decent skipper?? Shaw wouldnt last 80mins and Wilko drops after 60 mins??

4. Deacon

[Coby]

We all know that ashton made some strange selections and choices but it was working, untill, that is, we lost moody & rees, without a decent 7 on the field the games going to go dwon hill, we started to lose structure fast, and these 'experienced heads' didnt become of any value in the time they were needed most. Balshaw at fullback what was he thinking ridiculous!

[TTRITH]

4. Deacon

Would be my first thought, but does he lack international experiance, especially seeing as he hasnt been a regular for England in recent years?

[Gizmo]

Sorry to sound ignorant, but can anyone tell me, when Vickery left the field, who took over the captaincy? I can't remember Butler/Moore mentioning this, but I was probably in a state of shock at that point.

[john_o]

Probably controversial to Tigers fans, but I think that England need a "natural" leader and it might be in their interest to try and persuade Cozza to return from reteirement and help them complete the 6N's without more embarrasment.

We would miss him but he would pull England together.

I don't see Raging Bull doing anything captain like.

[Bill W]

Harry Ellis is the "natural" captain but he is injured. Tindall would be OK but he is injured. Moody is injured. Ben Kay would be a "safe pair of hands". Wilco - no way. ANO - who???