Musings re Tigers' current position

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Iain
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Musings re Tigers' current position

Post by Iain » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:36 pm

We are third after a great victory at Wasps, five points off the lead which is merely an afternoon's favourable result away from the top. Bristol I feel will fall away at some point. Indeed we have only lost two all season despite people's fears on the amount of international call ups we have suffered. And we are picking up wins away from home, which is certainly no easy task.
I make this point a lot, but is this not enough to silence some of the doubters on this board? No doubt when the international players are put back in we will have the anti-Pat brigade out in force.

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Post by Nabuk » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:41 pm

All right......Devils Advocate time,

Are we doing well because of our AI absences or the other teams AI absences ?

Iain
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Post by Iain » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:42 pm

Thats a good point actually. I mean that win over Irish the other week would never have happened if they had all their internationals available. I mean look at who they lost:

For a start they lost....


Oh hang on....

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Post by Nabuk » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:44 pm

Thinking off Wasps Smart A**e :D :D

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Post by TigerTimmy » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:44 pm

Not counting Wasps, the other three teams we've played haven't lost any (give or take a couple of players) players to the Internationals. Non of them have been as badly affected by call-ups as us or Wasps.
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Post by Bud » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:45 pm

The summer signings have been excellent. We really needed a number 8 to push Corry and to stand up during the international period, which we've now got with Jordan Crane. He really outclassed Dallaligo yesterday, with Pat even calling for England to be looking at him.

The international period has allowed players to stand up and be counted. It's clear now that Humphreys is now our clear second choice at flyhalf, and with some more time could even be pushing Goode. Crane, Abraham and Jennings could easily be our first choice backrow now, and it's going to be tough for the internationals to get back into the side.

Look at this international period compared to the last. Last year we lost at Worcester, Sale and Newcastle and this year we won three out of four, including beating Wasps away. This can only be a good thing for the team, showing our great strength in depth. I honestly believe that this year could be special for us. I think we've got the strongest pack in the GP and some exciting backs.
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Post by Chobbsy » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:47 pm

Nabuk wrote:All right......Devils Advocate time,

Are we doing well because of our AI absences or the other teams AI absences ?
It has to be a mixture of both, They "second string" boys, have performed OUTSTANDINGLY WELL but I think we all know that if we had come up against a full strength Wasps yesterday with our our internationals, we would have been soundly beat, but we didn't and we won, so well done to boys for a great performance, just think if Cabbage had been awarded that try against Saracens it would have been 4 from 4.
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Post by Phil B » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:48 pm

Pat Howard should be judged on results - that's the Professional Way. Like it or lump it, that's the way it is.

PH was quite rightly judged, in my view, as the "almost man" last season, but a loser none the less. Why? Because we did not win anything.

Judgement so far? Very good - but it's winning the one's that count that matter - and I like the way we are shaping up to be in contention.

And do you know what? I doubt that PH would argue with what I am saying.

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Post by Nabuk » Mon Nov 27, 2006 1:51 pm

Alright I'll rephrase ,would we have done as well if we had kept White, Correy, Chuter, Kay, Goode and Moody in the side?

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Post by Bud » Mon Nov 27, 2006 2:18 pm

Exactly. The fact is Pat has done an excellent job to put a squad together than can compete when the internations are away.
Ed

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Post by mightymouse » Mon Nov 27, 2006 2:45 pm

We're Doing marvelously well

Now let me see who is'nt here?

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Post by Bud » Mon Nov 27, 2006 2:50 pm

You can't say that it's all because these players were not available. Goode nearly turned the game around at Saracens.
Ed

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Musings re tigers current position .

Post by mike » Mon Nov 27, 2006 6:14 pm

Bud - sorry but I can't agree that Goode is our no 1 fly half . On current form Humphreys has way overtaken him and on skill levels and potential is our top fly half by a mile . At last we have someone who can run a backline in attack giving us a chance to win those important matches . Goode has always choked in the big games in the past and we should look to the future , not yesterday's men .

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Post by cal » Mon Nov 27, 2006 7:44 pm

Sadly, Goode only seems to release his full potential when he comes on as a sub. Saracens, Munster and England V South Africa being examples. Although he did set up Varndell for that try in Cardiff. My god that was awesome.

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Re: Musings re Tigers' current position

Post by dailywaffle » Mon Nov 27, 2006 11:41 pm

Iain wrote:We are third after a great victory at Wasps, five points off the lead which is merely an afternoon's favourable result away from the top. Bristol I feel will fall away at some point. Indeed we have only lost two all season despite people's fears on the amount of international call ups we have suffered. And we are picking up wins away from home, which is certainly no easy task.
I make this point a lot, but is this not enough to silence some of the doubters on this board? No doubt when the international players are put back in we will have the anti-Pat brigade out in force.
In the interests of debate, I thought I might put an alternative view ....

Pat's selection policy, on occasion, is difficult to understand. Humphreys has only made the most of his chance due to Burke being injured; had Burke been fit Humph probably wouldn't have been in the 22 against Irish. Playing Burke against Munster was a poor coaching decision, as was the decision to play an expansive game in terrible conditions. And don't get me started on Moody at 7 and Deacon at 6 !

Tigers discipline has been poor, which reflects badly on the coaches. Cockers playing the pantomime villian on the touchline has hardly helped. If the 'foot of Deacon' had been spotted against the Blues we might now be out of the HEC.

Tigers very average midfield play this season reflects poorly on the coaching of the backline, unless we accept that our backs are not of the necessary standard (possible).

On the positive side, I agree that we have excellent strength in depth in the forwards, and the signings of Ayerza, Castro and Crane have all been good decisions. These positives may be as much to do with Cockers as they do with Pat ?

Third is third, and we would have taken that before the AIs. However, I am inclined to think that it is almost in spite of Pat, rather than because of him. One could also argue that the quality of the GP has been poor this year, we certainly seem to be behind the Celtic league at the moment.

OK, maybe that's all a little harsh, but I don't think the garden is quite as rosey as you might have us believe !

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