Junior supporters on the crumbie terrace

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Rizzo
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Post by Rizzo »

and I'm 5'4" - last time I stood further back, I couldn't see round the big tall wide blokes around me.

I don't think it's negative towards families - I've brought mine since she was tiny - but I would not give up two or three steps on the terrace to allow kids AND parents to stand in front of me. What happens if the kid concerned is a 13 year old lad who's actually taller than I am? And he brings his Dad who is even taller and wider? How do you differentiate between small kiddies who cannot see over the barrier without a stool (in which case they're better on the first step back anyway) and the 14 year olds who are still technically junior members but can be taller than many adults? Would you have a height restriction - say, anyone over 5 feet 5 inches must stand further back?

No, I can see your argument, and I agree that some families cannot get there two hours before kick off - but the barrier is a long area - yesterday we arrived at 12 noon, gates opened about 12.15, we were in place on the A&L end 22 against the barrier by 12.20 ish - and it wasn't until well after 1.15 to 1.30 before the steps behind us filled up. A lot of people tend to want to stand on the barrier near the dugouts. In my view, to get that position, you have to be prepared to get there and in line outside the turnstiles at least 2.5 hours before kick off.

The wheelchair comparison is not correct either, since there is a special allocated area near the Clubhouse for wheelchair-bound fans.

I don't think it is negative towards families to say that I will (and do) let small kids in front or alongside us (even if it means we're squashed) but I am not doing it for their parents too.
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Demelza - another Mother
Tyzot
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Post by Tyzot »

I don't agree that people on here are anti children - In my case we support the team as a family. If adults wish to allow children through then thats great and has to be by choice and on an individual basis (sometimes I do - sometimes I don't- it rather depends on the observed behaviour of the child and its parents) but in my experience parents who shove their children to the front at Welford Road or elsewhere are often modivate by the desire not just to get them a better view, but to off load them on someone else so they can have an adult day out and / or a few beers and you can forget the idea that they will supervise them from a distance of a few yards. We have experienced this on many occasions - even having our own child pushed aside in front of us by slightly bigger unsupervised children.

In an ideal world Orange Tiger would be spot on - but sadly we are not in an ideal world, so lets just leave it to individual choice and concience.
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Post by Rizzo »

I don't seriously think the majority of fans using the Terrace would like the place divided into family enclaves and an area further back for adults. Health and Safety would preclude the areas being fenced off, so it would still be dependent on the people around that area and the stewards (who have enough to do as it is.) Who knows, we may well end up with an all seated stadium in the future, so that would solve any kids' problems!
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Demelza - another Mother
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Post by Orange Tiger »

Wheel chair bound fans have a special area at the front of the A&L. If the crumbie were built today, there would be a special area in that stand also. To have a couple of rows near the front for kids of say 12 years or younger (NOT PARENTS OR ADULTS) is a very easy thing to a chieve. The club simply paints some markings on to the steps, just like the hatching where there is no standing allowed.

If you are a verticly challenged adult, you will then be able to see over the childrens heads. You might even get the chance to soak up some of the atmosphere in some of the bars around the ground before KO in the knowledge that you will get a view of the field (all be it from the third or fourt row of the terrace)

As a club, I believe we should we should be fully inclusive of all members of the community. The club organises tag rugby, school visits, rugby courses, is present at many festivals, etc, etc. Yet if small children want to watch their heroes, they have to be at the ground 2 hours before KO??!
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Post by Tyzot »

Orange Tiger wrote:Wheel chair bound fans have a special area at the front of the A&L. If the crumbie were built today, there would be a special area in that stand also. To have a couple of rows near the front for kids of say 12 years or younger (NOT PARENTS OR ADULTS) is a very easy thing to a chieve. The club simply paints some markings on to the steps, just like the hatching where there is no standing allowed.

If you are a verticly challenged adult, you will then be able to see over the childrens heads. You might even get the chance to soak up some of the atmosphere in some of the bars around the ground before KO in the knowledge that you will get a view of the field (all be it from the third or fourt row of the terrace)

As a club, I believe we should we should be fully inclusive of all members of the community. The club organises tag rugby, school visits, rugby courses, is present at many festivals, etc, etc. Yet if small children want to watch their heroes, they have to be at the ground 2 hours before KO??!
It may not be ideal but queuing is still the fairest way - being open to the majority of people. As for point 2 - If vertically challenged or parents of small children prioritise beer over a good view then that is also their chioce, they could after all have invested that time in arriving earlier. IMHO that is often the root of the issue, although I do accept that this is not always the case and I do not mean that this is the motive of O T.

As for the practicalities - would the under 12s be expected to arrange themselves in height order and how would parents remain responsible for their actions when if the parent is tall they could be 6 rows back or even soaking up the atmosphere somewhere else?
I think that the club says no unaccompanied under 14s in the ground?
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Post by Dave Angel »

Just be grateful you aren't Northampton fans!

They have a minimum height restriction on the terrace to stop young children from going on there for H&S reasons.

Some people have said on here that the front few steps should be given over to children but how do you police it?

Would you have to be under a certain age to stand there? If so, do kids need to bring prioof of age with them? What happens if you have a particularly tall 10 year old?

Would it be based on height? If so, who polices it with the tape measure? What is the cut-off? Would short adults be allowed to stand with the children?

Where do the parents stand? Do they get to stand immediately behind their children on the next step or do they have to fit in where there is room some distance away & possibly out of eyesight?

Who is responsible for the children's behaviour if they mess about away from parental supervision?

The terrace has a maximum capacity and as such, can't have a few rows reserved completely for a minority of people. If they were still empty, how soon before KO would adults be allowed to move forward to fill up the gaps in front of them? What would happen if a group of children arrived late & everyone on the terrace had to step back to accommodate them at the front?

There are lots of issues that would arise from such a misguided policy of having the front few rows for children only. So much so that it would never work.


If you are that bothered about your kids getting a good view of the game, I'm afraid the answer is either to get there early enough for them to see clearly or pay the extra for seats. The club already make concessions to younger members in the form of cheaper tickets & the Junior Tiger club.
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Post by SPIKE@srufc »

I think this teaches a valuable life lesson,
- life isn't fair
- if you want something you have to be prepared to get up and go and get it, if that means queuing up for a couple of hours so be it.

I've only stood once with the boys and whilst they did get to the front it wasn't because they asked it was the because a few very kind people told them they should stand in front of them so they could see and after talking to me let the boys through. I stayed where I was. I could see them and they had a blast. (Which they do when we go to matches).

When we can get tickets I try to get into the Next stand near the club shop, don't know why but we like it there and have got to make some good friends. (Which I'm sure people do all over the ground).
SPIKE

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Rizzo
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Post by Rizzo »

just as an aside, there seems to be a large (and increasing) number of families with young kids and teenagers who attend the Development games when there are home games. This encourages youngsters to see the up and coming players, it's far less crowded and therefore a better view is easily obtainable and for ST and members you get the free tickets.
That's real encouragement for young fans and those learning the game at junior county level.

However, glance around you during those games, and you'll see (a) kids playing on the steps, running up and down and generally playing, (b) teenagers spending the entire game texting each other, goofing around and paying no attention to the game at all. I'm not suggesting ALL are like this, but many are - some girls from my daughter's school attend Development games and have clearly said they only go because it's free admission and "there are cute boys around to flirt with..."

Development isn't first team, admittedly - but kids would have more chance of seeing better and watching some class rugby played there too!
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Demelza - another Mother
Tyzot
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Post by Tyzot »

Boy has Dave Angel thought this out!


and Rizzo - I think I have seen these girls at the Dev matches - stood at the front facing away frrom the pitch discussing the merits of various boys they know in rather more detail than I like to hear! Perhaps I'm just getting old
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Post by Rizzo »

If you are, Tyzot, then so am I :lol: it annoys me. I commented to my daughter that she'd better not do the same, as if so I wouldn't be bringing her again.

Her reply was "As if I would! In any case, there are fifteen much cuter hunkier men running around on the pitch in Tigers' shirts!"
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Post by The Countess of Welford »

Rizzo wrote:just as an aside, there seems to be a large (and increasing) number of families with young kids and teenagers who attend the Development games when there are home games. This encourages youngsters to see the up and coming players, it's far less crowded and therefore a better view is easily obtainable and for ST and members you get the free tickets.
That's real encouragement for young fans and those learning the game at junior county level.
Which is precisely why families go because the kids get a better view and do not have to get there to the ground at the crack of the gates opening to get a good view!
So what you are saying is that it's tough cheese for people with kids at the first team matches and best to go to the Development matches instead. I thought many of the kids want to go to WR because they want to see the Martin Corrys of the world . I know mine did when they started going.
Another point. If Murrayfield can do it where the schoolkids get to be on the first rows for Scottish Internationals then why can't we somehow?
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Post by fierysam »

I'm in agreement with much of the sentiment on this subject........ I'm the lone gal in the group that I come with, all the men are well over 6ft, but they appreciate that I'm much shorter, so we arrive when the gates open, in order that I can enjoy the game along with them, instead of looking at someones back for the entire time. There are various other people who arrive afterwards, and all the shortest are put to the front, so everyone can enjoy the game.

As with everything else in this world, it seems like parents expect the world to revolve around their children. I have two nieces, the eldest is only 14 but she is already close to 6ft in height, the other is not far behind! - if the ruling was based on age,then she would go to the front, blocking my view, and that of many men! Maybe someone should suggest that many of our older supporters should be at the front along with the younger children, as each generation is getting taller - many women in their 40's and upwards are not as tall as the 12-15 year old supporters....

I'm afraid it has to be a case of first come first served, moderated with some common sense.
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Post by tigerstotty »

Hi Tyzot,

Just for the record, I'm anti-kids - can't stand the little blighters! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Post by breezer »

fierysam wrote:I'm afraid it has to be a case of first come first served, moderated with some common sense.
well said fierysam - I wouldn't dream of getting a spot at the front just because I am with my lad - especially as I am about 6'3"!
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Post by The Countess of Welford »

fierysam wrote: As with everything else in this world, it seems like parents expect the world to revolve around their children. I have two nieces, the eldest is only 14 but she is already close to 6ft in height, the other is not far behind! - if the ruling was based on age,then she would go to the front, blocking my view, and that of many men! Maybe someone should suggest that many of our older supporters should be at the front along with the younger children, as each generation is getting taller - many women in their 40's and upwards are not as tall as the 12-15 year old supporters....

I'm afraid it has to be a case of first come first served, moderated with some common sense.
I disagree. It has nothing to do with parents thinking the world owes it to them because they have kids. It's just common decency to let little ones to the front. As someone said previously, you wouldn't stand in front of a disabled person so why should you in front of children? I think we pride ourselves at Tigers with the fans behaviour, staying silent during the kickers attempts at goals, our friendliness with the opposite fans and so on so why should we be curmudgeonly about this issue?
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