How long before Elite clubs field non-Six Nations sides?
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How long before Elite clubs field non-Six Nations sides?
It is often suggested that the elite or Premiership clubs will go down the road of not having a Six-Nations qualified player in their XVs at certain times due to losing internationals during the Autumn and the Six Nations Period and linked to that the current fracas between the PRL and the RFU. Rather then have a number of players or possibly a full XV unavailable during those periods and suffer accordingly, these clubs would buy loads of players from the Southern Hemisphere, and possibly also from countries like USA and Canada.
All that has been mentioned on here, but how long will it be before the clubs put out a full non-six nations side during the Internationals Periods? Maybe even permanently?
All that has been mentioned on here, but how long will it be before the clubs put out a full non-six nations side during the Internationals Periods? Maybe even permanently?
International matches should be confined to a maximum of two blocks during the year, and no Premiership matches should take place at the same time. The blocks should preferably be after the end of the club season for 6-Nations / tour, and November or December (not both). There should be a maximum of 8 international matches a year, except in the year of a World Cup.
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That would be ideal, Pete. I am with you on the principles of limiting the number of international games and playing two blocks. However, I can't see there being an appetite for another 5 weeks or so of Six nations games after the end of the close season. Also, the clubs need those players back for pre-season training at some stage.
Simon
I shouldn't worry too much about the clubs having their players back for pre- season training. The Royal F.c.u.k Up ( formerly known as the RFU) will now have such a hold on the clubs that there won't be any pre- season training as the players will belong to them and not the clubs.And the (RFU) will say when pre-season training if any will start.
Rugby is in it's decline and the clubs now have no say in what happens to THEIR players.
So get used to seeing a reserve team playing or a load of foreigners turning out for the clubs.
I shouldn't worry too much about the clubs having their players back for pre- season training. The Royal F.c.u.k Up ( formerly known as the RFU) will now have such a hold on the clubs that there won't be any pre- season training as the players will belong to them and not the clubs.And the (RFU) will say when pre-season training if any will start.
Rugby is in it's decline and the clubs now have no say in what happens to THEIR players.
So get used to seeing a reserve team playing or a load of foreigners turning out for the clubs.
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G,
Is it the Royal or the Right F.c.u.k. Up?
Your scenario could well happen in the current conditions and attitude of the RFU. However, the RFU or whatever they wil be called will be signing the death warrant of Rugby at least at a top level in this country as:
1) Although there will be a core squad that the RFU will be able to "possess" initially, the well will eventually dry-up as the clubs by fielding reserves and foreign players will not able to produce the players needed to replace the elite players in time. The only way that those players could be replaced would by the RFU trawling around the country, signing up all sorts of players on a risk that they may one day be good enough for international level and then training them up to the required standard themselves. Can they feasibly do that?
2) As the crowds dwindle at Premiership grounds due to fans not wanting to see reserve players turn up or loads of foreigners they know nothing about or maybe don't even care about seeing, then those clubs lose money and may eventually have to fold. How will the RFU replace them except by phoney franchises that mean nothing to anybody?
3) Rugby Union in this country, if it isn't already, becomes a big laughing stock. Potential fans are turned off and even existing fans would turn their back on a sport that was run inadequately and ridiculously by a number of farts at Twickenham whose only aim is to line their own pockets and to gain as much power over the game as possible without any concern for anyone else. Rugby union cannot afford that.
4) As Rugby Union became even more ludicrously run and more of a laughing stock then even SKY would pull out of showing the sport in this country as they would see there was no point in showing such a ludicrous state of affairs and they would realise that fewer and fewer were interested in watching it here anyway. If SKY pulls out, then Rugby Union here has a huge financial hole to fill.
All of which cannot be seen by the blind fools at the RFU Headquarters who will be happy to continue trying to ruin the game for their own gains and will try to gloss over any cracks by having as many supposedly profit-making internationals at Twickers as possible. Even if one day, there is no-one decent left on England's part to play in them, and nobody wants to watch such embarassing matches either. either. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
Is it the Royal or the Right F.c.u.k. Up?
Your scenario could well happen in the current conditions and attitude of the RFU. However, the RFU or whatever they wil be called will be signing the death warrant of Rugby at least at a top level in this country as:
1) Although there will be a core squad that the RFU will be able to "possess" initially, the well will eventually dry-up as the clubs by fielding reserves and foreign players will not able to produce the players needed to replace the elite players in time. The only way that those players could be replaced would by the RFU trawling around the country, signing up all sorts of players on a risk that they may one day be good enough for international level and then training them up to the required standard themselves. Can they feasibly do that?
2) As the crowds dwindle at Premiership grounds due to fans not wanting to see reserve players turn up or loads of foreigners they know nothing about or maybe don't even care about seeing, then those clubs lose money and may eventually have to fold. How will the RFU replace them except by phoney franchises that mean nothing to anybody?
3) Rugby Union in this country, if it isn't already, becomes a big laughing stock. Potential fans are turned off and even existing fans would turn their back on a sport that was run inadequately and ridiculously by a number of farts at Twickenham whose only aim is to line their own pockets and to gain as much power over the game as possible without any concern for anyone else. Rugby union cannot afford that.
4) As Rugby Union became even more ludicrously run and more of a laughing stock then even SKY would pull out of showing the sport in this country as they would see there was no point in showing such a ludicrous state of affairs and they would realise that fewer and fewer were interested in watching it here anyway. If SKY pulls out, then Rugby Union here has a huge financial hole to fill.
All of which cannot be seen by the blind fools at the RFU Headquarters who will be happy to continue trying to ruin the game for their own gains and will try to gloss over any cracks by having as many supposedly profit-making internationals at Twickers as possible. Even if one day, there is no-one decent left on England's part to play in them, and nobody wants to watch such embarassing matches either. either. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
Negative Simon.
Premiership Rugby will flourish. Because that is where the fan base is.
RFU will go topside up because without Premiership players (and rfu will not be able to contract the 90+ players OBNSG needs to form a squad) they will not be able to field a competitive England XV.
PRL will then "take over" the RFU
Premiership Rugby will flourish. Because that is where the fan base is.
RFU will go topside up because without Premiership players (and rfu will not be able to contract the 90+ players OBNSG needs to form a squad) they will not be able to field a competitive England XV.
PRL will then "take over" the RFU
Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
What happened when the then governing body tried to enforce decisions on the northern clubs ?. They broke away and formed Rugby League. If the RFU want a repeat then they should keep on down this road. I am a Tigers fan first and I they will continue to be first in my eyes. Let's see England try and win games with National League players!
What happened when the then governing body tried to enforce decisions on the northern clubs ?. They broke away and formed Rugby League. If the RFU want a repeat then they should keep on down this road. I am a Tigers fan first and I they will continue to be first in my eyes. Let's see England try and win games with National League players!
As I have said on here before. If there is any doubt as to where Rugby will end up, if the R.F.U. gets their way, just look at Cricket.
There is very little doubt that the England Cricket team over the last couple of years have been very successful, with many of the team becoming household names.
However, very few people could tell you which counties these players actually play for, as they are allowed to play for their own “Team” so rarely.
Along with this county cricket is almost dead on its feet [with the exception of the 20 – 20] There now being so much international Cricket every summer, how many 5 day test matches & 1 day internationals are England playing this summer, I have lost count, all of course televised. Would you bother buying a season ticket for your Team if your only real chance of seeing your star names was on TV playing for England?
Sounds familiar? Thought so, it is 1 of the reason’s I thought long and hard before renewing my Tigers season ticket this time. I want to watch Rugby’s star names, both ours and the oppositions, playing at Welford Road. It is not so much the moving of games [both home and away] away from the “Preferred” Saturday 3pm slot that annoys so much, more the reason, why should we watch a much reduced Tigers team play on a Friday night, because England want to play the All Blacks on the Saturday.
My understanding is that certainly London Irish, maybe others have already taken the decision not to employ players that they are likely to loose to international call ups. [1 of the reasons they did so well last season] What will England do if others follow this precedent, how long before 1 man & a dog [presumably the refs Labrador] are the only 1’s watching club rugby?
In my opinion Rugby in this country needs to get a blank sheet of paper out & start from scratch, before it is too late.
Sorry for the essay but this club v country thing is getting beyond a joke, the only people benefiting from it will be the barristers on both sides.
There is very little doubt that the England Cricket team over the last couple of years have been very successful, with many of the team becoming household names.
However, very few people could tell you which counties these players actually play for, as they are allowed to play for their own “Team” so rarely.
Along with this county cricket is almost dead on its feet [with the exception of the 20 – 20] There now being so much international Cricket every summer, how many 5 day test matches & 1 day internationals are England playing this summer, I have lost count, all of course televised. Would you bother buying a season ticket for your Team if your only real chance of seeing your star names was on TV playing for England?
Sounds familiar? Thought so, it is 1 of the reason’s I thought long and hard before renewing my Tigers season ticket this time. I want to watch Rugby’s star names, both ours and the oppositions, playing at Welford Road. It is not so much the moving of games [both home and away] away from the “Preferred” Saturday 3pm slot that annoys so much, more the reason, why should we watch a much reduced Tigers team play on a Friday night, because England want to play the All Blacks on the Saturday.
My understanding is that certainly London Irish, maybe others have already taken the decision not to employ players that they are likely to loose to international call ups. [1 of the reasons they did so well last season] What will England do if others follow this precedent, how long before 1 man & a dog [presumably the refs Labrador] are the only 1’s watching club rugby?
In my opinion Rugby in this country needs to get a blank sheet of paper out & start from scratch, before it is too late.
Sorry for the essay but this club v country thing is getting beyond a joke, the only people benefiting from it will be the barristers on both sides.
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Like many on this website, I back the PRL and not the RFU. However, I feel there is a solution which can see all sides triumph.
We should move to a season where each tournament takes place in a bloc. For example:
Block 1 Guiness Premiership
Block 2 Heineken
Block 3 6 Nations
Block 4 Southern Hemisphere tests / World Cup
To make it work really well, you'd need to change the point at which the season starts, so we might end up like rugby league. People will no doubt complain abt summer rugby, but i think it is considerably preferable to the doomsday scenarios that are likerly to occur if we carry on in the current fashion.
We should move to a season where each tournament takes place in a bloc. For example:
Block 1 Guiness Premiership
Block 2 Heineken
Block 3 6 Nations
Block 4 Southern Hemisphere tests / World Cup
To make it work really well, you'd need to change the point at which the season starts, so we might end up like rugby league. People will no doubt complain abt summer rugby, but i think it is considerably preferable to the doomsday scenarios that are likerly to occur if we carry on in the current fashion.
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I saw a post on another forum that said, basically, the success of individual clubs was very much secondary to the success of the national team in the fan's eyes. It fairly confidently asserted that Leicester and Sale fans would put England ahead of their club.
Perhaps even more surprisingly, there seemed to be some positive responses to this, with some posters calling for the return of Divisional rugby. ( :shock: )
My response ... has the world gone mad ? Please put me right, but I would think that the real heartlands of club rugby (and I would always put us and Glaws as the top two in that category) would have fans that would support the club first and England second. The national team is clearly important in reaching out and growing the game, but I can't believe that many dedicated fans would happily see their team play second fiddle.
Perhaps even more surprisingly, there seemed to be some positive responses to this, with some posters calling for the return of Divisional rugby. ( :shock: )
My response ... has the world gone mad ? Please put me right, but I would think that the real heartlands of club rugby (and I would always put us and Glaws as the top two in that category) would have fans that would support the club first and England second. The national team is clearly important in reaching out and growing the game, but I can't believe that many dedicated fans would happily see their team play second fiddle.
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I agree with your comments Dailywaffle. The Club should come first and England second. Although the national team is important in reaching out and growing the game. We don't want to play second fiddle to it. For instance, if there was a Tigers game on the Saturday, I would go to that rather then an England game or any other international match.
Looks like we could be heading for a break away from the RFU by the PRL although I am not sure how successfully they can manage that.
I like Elford Tiger's suggestion of tournaments being played in blocks and if that means summer rugby then why not? The season could start in early March or possibly February to accomodate the World Cup. The first gap after the seasons were changed for the top players would be about 7 months before pre-season training so during that time the players could for instance play for clubs in the southern hemisphere to keep their fitness up and busy. The other problem would be what would happen to the Players not playing in the internationals as they would have a very long period before pre-season training?
Looks like we could be heading for a break away from the RFU by the PRL although I am not sure how successfully they can manage that.
I like Elford Tiger's suggestion of tournaments being played in blocks and if that means summer rugby then why not? The season could start in early March or possibly February to accomodate the World Cup. The first gap after the seasons were changed for the top players would be about 7 months before pre-season training so during that time the players could for instance play for clubs in the southern hemisphere to keep their fitness up and busy. The other problem would be what would happen to the Players not playing in the internationals as they would have a very long period before pre-season training?