Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

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Offside
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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Offside » Fri May 27, 2022 1:40 pm

Scott1 wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 1:35 pm
Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 11:53 am
Big article in today's Times on Stuart Lancaster; "From an England failure to Leinster's most prized asset". It recounts how he has used 60 players in 26 matches and beat Munster last Saturday without a single first team player. They run 3 sides in training and will lose 17 - 20 players to the national side.
SL isn't in charge,its more of a dig at England. Although I'm not saying he isn't valuable, we all know where his talents lie.
It would be interesting to have a Leinster fans vote. “Most prized” suggests more prized that Cullen, or any player on the pitch. Do you think the vote would go that way? I doubt it. Highly prized yes, most prized - no.

Offside
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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Offside » Fri May 27, 2022 1:41 pm

Offside wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 1:40 pm
Scott1 wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 1:35 pm
Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 11:53 am
Big article in today's Times on Stuart Lancaster; "From an England failure to Leinster's most prized asset". It recounts how he has used 60 players in 26 matches and beat Munster last Saturday without a single first team player. They run 3 sides in training and will lose 17 - 20 players to the national side.
SL isn't in charge,its more of a dig at England. Although I'm not saying he isn't valuable, we all know where his talents lie.
It would be interesting to have a Leinster fans vote. “Most prized” suggests more prized that Cullen, or any player on the pitch including Sexton. Do you think the vote would go that way? I doubt it. Highly prized yes, most prized - no.

TMC
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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by TMC » Fri May 27, 2022 3:12 pm

Hugely valued and respected. If you had to chose to lose Lancaster or Furlong would be a very tough one.
Lancaster comes across as a very humble & likeable guy. Looking in from the outside like everyone else it seems like a very flat coaching structure and all coaches’ input valued equally with Cullen holding a casting vote. Cullen has the humility to step back and let others take the credit, it doesn't seem to bother him unduly. Lancaster gets a lot of the media attention as he is brilliant at developing young players but one of the unsung coaching heroes Leicester fans might not be aware of is Denis Leamy ex Munster and Ireland Number 8 who is the Leinster breakdown coach. He is the man responsible for the sub 3 second breakdowns. Moving to Munster next season unfortunately. Expect their ball recycling to improve.
Like all teams Leinster will fade in time, I expect there will be a post Sexton hangover when he retires as they are just a different team with him there. Ciaran Frawley might well be the long term answer ahead of Ross/Harry Byrne but Sexton really is a once in a generation player. Raises the levels of everyone around him.
With international commitments Leinster are generally without their players for 12/4 weeks of the season, with the IRFU managing game time, those international players that go on summer tours are held back from starting their pre season until late August / early September and generally get back playing league games a few weeks before the Autumn Internationals to get match fit for them, they then go to Ireland for the AIs and back again for the 6 Nations, that’s part of the reason why they play so few league games.
There is a lot of airtime given to player welfare, the IRFU have less top end playing talent in absolute terms, so they have to manage their player’s welfare pretty well. That’s the benefit of a centrally controlled system. Rather than flogging guys for 30+ games a season their long term playing careers would be better served by more rotation/player management in the English game. Maybe the English clubs should consider a limit on the number of league games players can play in the regular season. Would force management to look at the schedule, target specific games for particular players and force them to rotate and develop youth. Would very likely result in longer playing careers and less injuries. Might level the playing field too somewhat. Don’t know the percentages but there seem to be relatively more native 30+ year olds playing professionally in Ireland relative to the game in England.
IMHO the game has gone so atritional that a team's first XV cant play week in week out anymore.

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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Old Hob » Fri May 27, 2022 3:17 pm

Scott1 wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 1:35 pm
Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 11:53 am
Big article in today's Times on Stuart Lancaster; "From an England failure to Leinster's most prized asset". It recounts how he has used 60 players in 26 matches and beat Munster last Saturday without a single first team player. They run 3 sides in training and will lose 17 - 20 players to the national side.
SL isn't in charge,its more of a dig at England. Although I'm not saying he isn't valuable, we all know where his talents lie.
Do we?

The Time article is quite specific in listing his coaching attributes and includes quotes from B O'D among others who said, "He's cutting edge in his coaching.." Sexton contacted Lancaster directly about joining having been impressed by him. The whole article is littered with people praising him so I don't know where your opinion comes from.
Omnia dicta fortiora si dicta Latina

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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Scott1 » Fri May 27, 2022 3:38 pm

Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 3:17 pm
Scott1 wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 1:35 pm
Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 11:53 am
Big article in today's Times on Stuart Lancaster; "From an England failure to Leinster's most prized asset". It recounts how he has used 60 players in 26 matches and beat Munster last Saturday without a single first team player. They run 3 sides in training and will lose 17 - 20 players to the national side.
SL isn't in charge,its more of a dig at England. Although I'm not saying he isn't valuable, we all know where his talents lie.
Do we?

The Time article is quite specific in listing his coaching attributes and includes quotes from B O'D among others who said, "He's cutting edge in his coaching.." Sexton contacted Lancaster directly about joining having been impressed by him. The whole article is littered with people praising him so I don't know where your opinion comes from.
How do you know what talents I'm talking about if I havnt even listed them? 🤔

Old Hob
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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Old Hob » Fri May 27, 2022 3:57 pm

That's why there's a question mark. You said he's not in charge; the article says different.
Omnia dicta fortiora si dicta Latina

Scott1
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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Scott1 » Fri May 27, 2022 4:40 pm

Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 3:57 pm
That's why there's a question mark. You said he's not in charge; the article says different.
The article is having a subtle dig at England,SL is not in charge. He’s a big part of the coaching group but I’ve never heard of him being in charge outside of that article ,speaking to Leinster fans,watching Leinster games etc. Even a quick google search lists him as with the back room team as a senior coach

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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by wigworth » Fri May 27, 2022 4:50 pm

Scott1 wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 4:40 pm
Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 3:57 pm
That's why there's a question mark. You said he's not in charge; the article says different.
The article is having a subtle dig at England,SL is not in charge. He’s a big part of the coaching group but I’ve never heard of him being in charge outside of that article ,speaking to Leinster fans,watching Leinster games etc. Even a quick google search lists him as with the back room team as a senior coach
I thought it was pretty well known that Cullen was in charge and Lancaster is a coach. Also what is the article trying to dig at, that somehow England would be in a better position to win the World Cup with Lancaster as coach rather than Eddie?

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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Tiglon » Fri May 27, 2022 5:08 pm

To be honest, I've always wondered what Lancaster is actually responsible for - not having a dig at him or at Leinster, I just don't understand the setup.

McBryde you would assume is forwards coach, being an Assistant Coach who used to be a forward. Contepomi is Assistant Coach but also described as backs coach. Leamy is Contact Skills Coach - doesn't sound like he organises the defence, more like focuses on the tackling, jackaling, breakdown etc skills?

So Lancaster is Cullen's number 2 with specific responsibility for... ? Organising defence? Everything? Nothing?

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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by wigworth » Fri May 27, 2022 5:18 pm

Tiglon wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 5:08 pm
To be honest, I've always wondered what Lancaster is actually responsible for - not having a dig at him or at Leinster, I just don't understand the setup.

McBryde you would assume is forwards coach, being an Assistant Coach who used to be a forward. Contepomi is Assistant Coach but also described as backs coach. Leamy is Contact Skills Coach - doesn't sound like he organises the defence, more like focuses on the tackling, jackaling, breakdown etc skills?

So Lancaster is Cullen's number 2 with specific responsibility for... ? Organising defence? Everything? Nothing?
Head of riding coat-tails, all it says on the Leinster website is senior coach so it could be anything.

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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Old Hob » Fri May 27, 2022 5:22 pm

Quote:
"Lancaster has Leo Cullen as lieutenant and head coach but largely runs day to day training".
Omnia dicta fortiora si dicta Latina

Scott1
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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Scott1 » Fri May 27, 2022 5:39 pm

Lancasters forte is helping age grade players make that transition to senior rugby. Identifying and developing young talent and that’s what’s I’ve been told he’s doing at Leinster. But instead of it being 6-18yo players he’s now taking established young squad and Leinster B players and bridging that gap to first team squad.

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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Tiglon » Fri May 27, 2022 6:37 pm

Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 5:22 pm
Quote:
"Lancaster has Leo Cullen as lieutenant and head coach but largely runs day to day training".
If Lancaster runs training, what does the Head Coach do? :smt017

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Re: Tigers v Leinster (H) - Saturday 07th May 2022 - 5-30pm KO

Post by Wayne Richardson Fan Club » Fri May 27, 2022 7:02 pm

Tiglon wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 6:37 pm
Old Hob wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 5:22 pm
Quote:
"Lancaster has Leo Cullen as lieutenant and head coach but largely runs day to day training".
If Lancaster runs training, what does the Head Coach do? :smt017
Deano style role?

Whatever he does Lancaster appears to be a much valued member of the set up.
To win is not as important as playing with style!

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